paws120

Sally and Holly… all I can say is I am on about my third sip of coffee and thank goodness I had already swallowed when I read “the typo” 😂😂 😂 

right or it would come thru the nose too 😉 hehe

😂😂 😂 Purrkins is slowly coming around, still resting a lot and still not steady on three. I will update a little below here;) yes, lots to catch up on been months. We will, and we feel a lot lighter knowing Mr.P will be ok considering the fear!

Big hugs!

megstamum

I went back and spotted it too! Thanks for the giggle. 

Hope Purrkins is allowing you and Mark are now getting some well-earned relaxation time, and staying off the kitchen cupboards…

I only had my phone, and you know I don't do good typing on my phone, so I only added emojis. Those I can sometimes see w/o my glasses. Hehe

Yes, thanks again, Sally; we all need a good giggle here. ( miss those days, Clare;)🤣😂😆

I did get some rest yesterday 7 hours whoo hoo;)  no cupboards in the immediate future anyway;) We are all tripled baby gated upstairs 😉 

🫂😘🦊💫

luckysmom20

Holly & Purrkins,  I was so involved with Lucky this week I had no idea what you were facing. I’m so thrilled that both the MRI and the spinal tap had such great outcomes!!!  

Of course, and we would not want it any other way! 

luckysmom20

I had a dog that was on phenobarb for epilepsy. She had grand mal seizures. You are correct that you have to get it to a therapeutic level, but a word of warning, the amount of phenobarb can change to keep him in the therapeutic level. With that being said, every animal is different as is each situation.  Just wanted to share that the dosage might change. 

We appreciate any wisdom; this has not been discussed yet very helpful to know. Thank you😘! 

again, such thrilling news!!  I hope you are catching up on your sleep!! And you are staying warm!!!

Happy tripawd dance!!!

Thanks, Barb !  We fully appreciate the added happy tripawd dance!💃🕺🏼💃

Really, we have no words to express relief and gratitude! It has been months of terror, monitoring, the unknown, new meds, testing, decisions,  sedation, little sleep!

Beyond grateful, Purrkins is on a different side of this right now.  We will get caught up on our rest in time. 🙂

Hugs and Scratches to Lucky!

krun15

~Thanks, Karen.

The spirit pugs continue to enlighten and teach us all!!

krun15

My Pug Tani was on phenobarb for most of her life- from age 2 until she passed at almost 15 years old.  In her case though she had a diagnosed brain injury so we knew what we were treating.  Pheno actually kept her seizures pretty well controlled although she still had them.  When she first started on phenobarb it had a sedating affect on her, but as her body got used to it that pretty much went away.  The biggest side effect problem we battled was that it made her HUNGRY!!!  As a Pug she was a food hog but the pheno made it even worse.  She was often a bit on the chunky side, if I cut back on her food she would eat anything…bugs, sticks, little rocks.  I finally took her off kibble as the main food source and that finally got her weight down.

We have the sedation big time with the increase in dose.  Very concerning.

Any chance you remember how long it took for Tani to adjust to the meds? We keep hearing Purrkins will adjust but no timeframe on when.

Yes, we had the same side effect with Purrkins starving more than usual, I should add:)  He gained weight since starting the meds, apparently another side effect. The kitty vet said not to worry right now as we did not know what we were dealing with, but she had me send her the ounces (amount of food) we feed and nutritional content to go over so she can help us in the future and how to counteract the meds best. I figured we would have to cut back further because Purrkins is not burning any calories lying around. It is our constant battle with tweaking his portions, so I look forward to getting her input! We do not feed any kibble;)

Thankfully Purrkins does not eat sticks and such, not yet anyway I'm not sharing this info either;) we were listening to the pathetic meows - I'm starving! Now with the increased dosage and the anesthesia test tap etc., he is not starving!? Purrkins is eating on his own now thankfully, he chatted with me this a.m, which was a welcome surprise. Purring etc

She would sometimes go more than a month without a seizure, in fact sometimes I didn’t see them but I knew she had them because one of the beds would have pee in it (she always peed during her seizures) and it would be a day and a half or two days before her energy level was back up to normal.  

Also, good to know, thanks!

Purrkins were focal - whiskers, ears, eyes, head neck. that was plenty to see., I do remember my Grams💖 Siberian husky growing up at grand mals and how we helped her; she was also on pheno. I remember giving Tonka her pills in marshmallows;) All this is coming back to me now of course.

Every now and then we would have a discussion about taking her off phenobarb but because of the known brain injury and becasue she was generally doing really well we decided not to change anything. I think we did blood work every 6 months to check organ function and check phenobarb levels.  

I understand, and you were treating the cause. We are treating the symptoms. We do bloodwork every 6 months now as the boys are at that age & more lately as they wanted more bloodwork done for neurology. Now the plasma levels,  I'm hopeful Purrkins can get a break after Tuesday. Enough already, he says, but the kitty vet is not stressful for him. Unlike a traditional practice. 

Once she was 10 years old or so (the original neurologist thought she would only live to be 8 or 9) sometimes the med level would be below therapeutic levels but because she was still stable we didn’t change anything.

Because of her brain injury or seizures both? No timestamps being placed here and we know those are just that estimate nothing more;)

Again This is all so new for us. We appreciate any input, advice, questions. I'm a sponge at this point!

Purrkins first plasma level check was below therapeutic range and why they increased the dosage. It will be interesting to see the results on Tuesday. We will get those on Wed.

I think it's too much, but again this is all so new so I don't know what's what yet!

That reminds me- check on what time the blood work is supposed to be done in regards to when he gets the dose of phenobarb. I know that’s important for determining if the dose it therapeutic.

And I’m sure you know to be very careful if you get to take him off the meds, it most likely will cause seizures if it is stopped suddenly.

This has not been mentioned to us. Wonder why this makes sense!!!

We give Purrkins his meds every 12 hours, 7:00 am & 7:00 pm. We go to the kitty vet on Tuesday at 11:20? Timeframe?

Yes, we do, but thanks for putting the information here. We know this is not a drug that can be stopped and has to be weaned off.  IF and when we can do this. I would never mess with the pheno dosage w/o supervision 😉  knock on wood ✊🏻🪵 , Purrkins is not having spells (seizures) since the increase.

We were told it's about quality of life that it is possible to have break thru seizures, and the goal is to have less, and that would be a success. 

Again thanks for all this information, you guys. It is much appreciated & the unwavering support! 

Love you all!

💝💝💝

krun15 said
Disclaimer: Tani was diagnosed in 2002 so I'm really working the 'way back machine' here

Karen,
Thanks for taking the time and sharing all these details with us; the information is priceless! I  hope it was a good trip back! 😁 Thanks, Tani, for helping Mr. P & me especially!

In fact it was so long ago that Vet's didn't have their own MRI's- the neurologist sort of snuck Tani into the regular hospital after hours to do her MRI!

 How lovely they made this happen for Tani! Gem!

Any chance you remember how long it took for Tani to adjust to the meds?

Not really.  I do have to change my info on this a little though.  There were times though out her life when she just wanted to stay in bed after breakfast or dinner which was when she got her meds. Not all the time though- just occasionally. In addition to her bigger seizures Tani would have smaller ones (can't remember what each was called).  She would just have this far away look in her eyes- she clearly wasn't present.  Then all of a sudden she would 'come back'- she would be happy to see me like I had been gone and just got back. She would be tired after those episodes too so it could be she had those mini-seizures.

YES, Purrkins has had the same look i know exactly what you mean!

I know Purrkins eyes and expressions, and that was my first clue something was not right!! He stepped out of his eyes!!! If ever i had a doubt, i would know when it is time...  Seeing Purrkins like he was - I never will question myself again. I will know. Hard not going there when your in the situation.

Good to know this explains more possibly to me of what we are seeing? Purrkins starts to rally, and it is time for the next dose.  This is since the increase and overnight stay, so it is hard to know what's what. I have spoken to Dr. R and the attending neuro. They are saying this is the pheno.

Thankfully Purrkins does not eat sticks and such, not yet anyway

My parent's had an apple tree at their house, the Pug girls were there often.  I once found Tani happily munching on a smushed, brown, ant covered apple she found in the backyard.  She had ants all over her face and couldn't care less.  After that the first thing I had to do when we got to their house was race Tani to the backyard and pick up any apples.

😁🤢The apples and the ants Karren omc and dear Tani munching the ant covered apples! I can visualize the entire scene. 😁I know it was not funny at the time, but you smile now telling it, right;) Hopefully, she did not have ant bites too.

Because of her brain injury or seizures both?

Because of her brain injury, she was diagnosed by MRI with hydrocephalus or fluid on the brain. She also had a spinal tap to confirm that she did not have Pug Dog Encephalitis which is always fatal.  I saw the pictures and basically there was a large area where there should have been brain matter but instead there was fluid.  Usually puppies are diagnosed early in life and if severe enough they don't live very long but Tani was 2 when she started having seizures.  The vet said it would shorten her life but he didn't know by how much, when I pressed him he guessed she would have 6 or 7 years.  He also said her brain function was very compromised and actually called her 'retarded' (again, terms from 2002). Tani wasn't the smartest dog and took forever to learn new things but once she learned she never forgot.

Thanks for sharing this as well! I will ask for a copy i would like to see the scan digitally. I normally would have but with all this curbside ugh,

OH MY, on the wording, i cringe reading this. I wish we could say we have come leaps and bounds from 2002, but...we still have leaps and bounds to go IMO! We call that differently-abled; of course, she never forgot!

We give Purrkins his meds every 12 hours, 7:00 am & 7:00 pm. We go to the kitty vet on Tuesday at 11:20? Timeframe?

Tani got hers between 5 and 6 morning and night.  I would just verify with the vet if they care when he gets his dose vs. when his blood is drawn. In general unless you have an extended release type of medication the amount in your system will be high right after you take it and be low right before your next dose (depending too on how the med is metabolized). I think they wanted to do Tani's blood work midway though the doses.  It might also just be OK that they know when he got his dose.  It could also be that it doesn't matter anymore!

No extended-release regular pheno.  Dr. R knows our schedule, but i will inquire about this on Tuesday; she may have booked us at this time for a reason. She made the appt each time on the plasma levels, not the routine thru the front desk (phone, of course)

I also wanted to share that at first I was worried if she didn't get her meds exactly 12 hours apart- or if she would immediately  have a seizure if we missed a dose.  For Tani this was not the case.  Of course I did my best to keep her on schedule but things happen.  Tani was diagnosed with IBD a few years later and threw up all her food for about 3 weeks until we got it under control.  I switched to giving her her meds away from meals with the hopes that some of it got into her system before she threw up again - it worked for the most part.  Tani was really easy to pill but every  now and then I would find a pheno pill on the floor hours after I had fed the dogs. Since I didn't know for sure when she spit the pill out (it could even have been the day before) I just waited to give her a pill when the next dose was due.

Ok, they have told us as close to 12 hours apart as you can. I have alarms set and get it in on time as they have repeated this to us, which was also my fear. Get the meds in, and Purrkins not having seizures! This is all I felt i could do or think i could do to help him.

Not an issue right now, but yes, life can get in the way, and this helps to take the edge off a bit;) We have a routine with both boy's meds and supplements, so adding this pill is really no big deal. The big deal is Purrkins is not adjusting to it yet. 

So far, so good, no puking, and i make sure to give the meds after a meal. I have no issues giving the guys meds; we have a little system that works, thankfully.

I cringed, though, because the tech told me to put the pill in purrkins food. UGH NO, we have 2 boys, and they are beyond wise. Saxton would scarf it down and have pheno in him.  I hate they even suggested this to us, and thankfully we know better. BUT what about the person that does not!?! 

Thanks a million, Karen & Tani💫🍏🐜😁🐾

Loads of love!

XOXO

💝💝💝

You guys see what I do;) YES!😁

😁

 I had to share Mr. P's night;) I'm off to bed 🤞🏻 shiFt change;)

💝💝💝