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Caring for a Three Legged Dog or Cat

Tripawds is the place to learn how to care for a three legged dog or cat, with answers about dog leg amputation, and cat amputation recovery from many years of member experiences.
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Amputation Decision
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Forum Posts: 9
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24 November 2021 - 12:56 pm
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I’m new to this group and trying to make a decision on amputation of a front leg for my dog Katie.  I could really use some perspective from others who have been through this.  She is an 11 year old Sheppard mix who has a tumor in her shoulder – discovered by x-ray a few days ago.  My initial thought was that she is not a dog who is going to do well on 3 legs and that I just couldn’t put her through that, when she may only live a couple more months anyway.  But now I am wondering if that is the right decision.

She has been slowing down and in some pain for the last couple years.  Jumping into my vehicle (she refuses to use a ramp) was a problem and lots of yelps when she first stood up after lying down.  Before she started limping on this front leg, 2 weeks ago, I thought that her pain was probably her back legs, but wasn’t sure about that.  She has also become more and more anxious the last couple years, but I wonder now if that was pain related.  Until a few days ago she was only on Dasuquin for pain.  Now she is also taking Carprofen, Tramadol, and Gabapentin.

She is 85 lbs (but not overweight at all) so I can’t help her around much.  Even my attempts to get her to use a ramp to get in my vehicle have not gone well.  She doesn’t like change and tends to panic when I try to make her do something new.

I just have a gut feeling that she is not going to do well like so many of the success stories I read about.  The thought of seeing her fall and then struggle to get up just breaks my heart.  And, I have two other dogs not quite as big as her but big enough to unintentionally knock her down.  One of them is a tripawd himself, a back leg badly injured as a puppy, and he gets by pretty well.

I’m pretty sure that if I go with the amputation that I won’t be willing to put her through chemotherapy too.  So, from what I’ve read she probably only has a few months left with amputation only.

So if there is anyone out there who has gone through amputation on a similar large dog, I would appreciate any experiences you can share.   Thank you.

The Rainbow Bridge



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24 November 2021 - 1:31 pm
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Hi Katie and family, welcome. Your future posts won't need approval so post away.

What a crazy coincidence you already have a Tripawd. So you have most of the Triapwd experience part down, just not with this beginning phase. Don't worry, we can help.

I'm sorry to hear about the diagnosis. It's so similar to many others who have been through this journey, you are not alone.

It sounds like yes, she could have been having some untreated pain before the tumor developed. That wouldn't be unusual for a larger dog her age. And that anxiety could be part of the pain too, that's a very common pain signal in dogs.

Many dogs refuse to use ramps. It's a visual thing. Dogs have a hard time with depth perception and ramps can be really scary to many pups. Just because she won't use it doesn't mean she can't adapt to change.

But, you know her better than anyone else. How else is she resistant to change? 

When it comes to chemo, it's always optional. Statistically it gives dogs a better shot at longevity after amputation, but we've found that you just can't predict who will do well and who will not. Some dogs live longer with and without chemo. Our own Jerry lived two years without it (he had osteosarcoma too), and he didn't have chemo. Other dogs have gone way longer with it, without it, and everything inbetween. If you don't want to do it, that's OK, nobody here will judge you for that decision because there are no right or wrong choices. Every situation is different. 

Many people have gone through amputation with larger dogs up to 175 pounds. 85 is pretty small in comparison. Our Size and Age Matters topic has plenty of examples, and these posts about Giant Breed Tripawds.

If you are at all in doubt about her ability to do well, I recommend getting an opinion from an orthopedic specialist. They can at least give you a perspective about her physical qualities that can influence life on 3. As for her personality, you'll have to decide on that, I wish we could help there.

Gotta run for a bit but stay tuned for feedback from others.

It's better to hop on three legs than to limp on four.™
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24 November 2021 - 3:39 pm
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Thank you for such a quick reply.  I will explore those posts you pointed me toward.  I downloaded the Three Legs and a Spare book too, which looks like it has some good information and resources. 

 I’m afraid that my other tripawd dog really doesn’t prepare me for how Katie will come through because he has been a 3 legger since he was just a few weeks old.  So that is all he has ever known.  Plus, it’s a back leg.  He still has his 4th leg but can’t use it.  He broke it very badly, had a couple surgeries and was then in a splint for so long that the tendon (or ligament?) fused to the bone, so he can’t straighten the leg out enough to use it much.  But it doesn’t seem to cause him any pain at all.

 Many, many years ago I had a dog Katie’s size who blew out both of her knees when she was only 18 months old.  We went through surgeries and the recovery was really hard, and she was young and I was younger too, and much stronger than I am now.  She recovered well but then died of sudden heart failure a year later.  I’m sure she had a congenital heart condition, but I’ll never know if all of the anesthesia contributed to that or not.

 Thank you for that recommendation on an orthopedic specialist.  If I could get one to come to my house I would do that, but of course that isn’t going to work.  Getting Katie into my vehicle is extremely difficult and from what I’ve read it seems that she is at pretty great risk of a bad fracture at this point.  So I hate to push our luck with more trips to Vets.  Plus, it is extremely stressful for her to go into environments like that.  Her vision is getting bad, so I think that makes it worse. 

I think you are right that refusing to use a ramp is at least partially due to her poor vision.  And also this is an example of it being problematic that she is resistant to change.  She has always jumped into my SUV from the side door, so trying to get her to use a ramp in back is a change that she refuses to make, and she is big enough that it is hard for me to force her to do what she doesn’t want to.  There have been bad experiences in the past with me making her use a ramp and her slipping a little then panicking.  In fact I’m sure that is how her initial minor limp turned into a really bad one.

But, with a modified coffee table plus a ramp, I was able to get her in and out the side door to take her to the Vet appointment a few days ago without injury.  So, I guess that is progress.  But, that trip to the Vet was very stressful for her, so I wonder how it will go next time I try.

 Thank you for sharing about your dog Jerry.  That is encouraging.  I also downloaded the Dog Cancer Survival Guide a couple days ago and have been reading that and feel a little bit encouraged that maybe with the supplements recommended plus changes in diet, it will tip the scale in her favor even without chemotherapy.

 Well I’ve rambled on enough.  Thanks again.  I will be back for more reading.

Virginia




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24 November 2021 - 9:03 pm
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No. You are not rambling!  You are trying to,process all the research you are doing and see how it relates to your sweet Katie.  We understand  how overwhelming  all this can be at this point.  The fear, the uncertainty,  the mental and physical exhaustion  as you try to plot a path forward....yeah, we get it!  You have definitely  come to the right place for support, information and understanding. 

Ditto everything Jerry said.  As you can see, you are not alone.

Try and keep thi gs chunked down right now.  You can make decisions  about chemo or not later.Your main focus right now needs to be getting Katie evaluated by an Orthopedic Surgeon to evaluate  what's going on with her back legs and to determine  if she's  a good candidate  for surgery.

Has her regular Vet checked her out in the last one or two years for arthritis  or hip issues?  Guess I'm asking if any "issue" has been professionally  identified  yet?  Have you seen any noticeable positive  difference now that she's taking her pain meds?  So do  you think she's any less "anxious" (which, as you said, could have been pain)?

I do understand  the difficulty  of getting a large dog into a vehicle when it's just yourself and an unwilling  doggy.  And if you live rurally  with no close by help, that  makes it more daunting. 

Possibly  a Mobile Rehabilitation  Specialist  could help with the evaluation  as a starting point. Where are you located?  Maybe we can help find one on your area.  They are really good as another tool to help assess if your Katie has any other issues that would impact her candidacy  for amputation. 

I certainly  understand you have a lot of "layers" to your decision beyond just whether  she is a candi based on an Orthopedic  evaluation.  Her anxiety, fear of change, etc. are important  factors that need to be considered  too.

The only input I can offer along those lines is that the amputation  surgery itself requires an overnight stay where the dogs are happily seda6 on so e really good drugs.  Also, if a dog is too anxious during the first part of recovery,  the Vet will prescribe a Trazedone  to help with any anxiety.   You could also check into that as an option to help"calm him" for any Bet visits leading up to surgery (if that's  a path you take)

One other quick insight.  We have a long time member named Karen who was owned by Stubborn Pug Maggie.  Karen was having  an awful time with her recovery.  Stubborn Pug Maggie wasn't  necessarily in physical pain, but she pretty much shut down and just was not a happy camper.  Karen realized it was because  Maggie hated changes it took her a bit longer to adapt to three.  Once she did, she loved life large for another several years.

I'll just add that no dog has a timeframe stamped  on their butt and they sure don't count days on a calendar.  All they care is being pain free and going from one moment to the next while being spoiled and loved.  

So again, try and keep thi gs chunked  down.  See if you can get a Rehab Specialist  to make a house call.  Or see if you can get someone,  anyone, to help you get Katie to an Orthopedic Vet....and maybe eith the help of a little Trazedone.

STAY CONNECTED and let us k ow as a y que and concerns  come to mind.  We are here for you, okay?

Hugs

Sally and Alumni Happy Hannah and Merry Myrtle and Frankie too!

Happy Hannah had a glorious additional bonus time of over one yr & two months after amp for osteo! She made me laugh everyday! Joined April's Angels after send off meal of steak, ice cream, M&Ms & deer poop!

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25 November 2021 - 11:40 am
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Thank you Benny55 (Sally?) for taking the time to offer compassion and some good thoughts.  Sorry for your loss of Hannah, but I’ll bet her last year+ was precious time for both of you.  I do sense that although Katie is pretty miserable right now, she is enjoying how I'm spoiling her - and how mad that is making the other 2 dogs.

 This is probably going to be a serious case of TMI below, but I thought it wouldn’t hurt to get details out there in case something clicks and gives you an idea or suggestion.

You asked if Katie had been evaluated by her regular vet for arthritis.  Not a thorough evaluation with x-rays, but mostly based on my description of how she would often yelp when first standing up from lying down and sometimes when jumping into my vehicle.  So my vet started her on Dasuquin a couple years ago based on that.  I never could tell for sure whether it was front legs or back legs bothering her, until a couple months ago I started noticing her holding a back leg up for a little bit when she first stood up from lying down.  But she still enjoyed hiking, with no favoring of any limb when we were out.  She would occasionally let out a little yelp when running off trail, which I assumed was stepping on a stick or something.  Now, I’m thinking it might have been the tumor in her shoulder.

Then a little over 2 weeks ago Katie yelped a little when jumping out of my vehicle when we were out for a hike, and while on the hike she was noticeably limping on the front leg.  So when we got home I tried to make her use a ramp to get out and she slipped a little and panicked and jumped and then the limp was much worse and the next morning she was in REALLY bad shape.  Not wanting to go outside, not interested in eating.  So I called my vet’s office to see if I could get a prescription for the pain.  A tumor never even occurred to me.  I was thinking pulled muscle, torn ligament, etc.  Due to confusion/miscommunication it took several days to get the Carprofen and Katie didn’t improve at all during those few days.  Then when she started on Carprofen there was a big improvement.  Still limping severely, but she got her appetite back.  Then, the trip to the vet a few days ago was hard on her and despite the fact that I added Tramadol and Gabapentin after that, I can see that she is still very uncomfortable, but still eating moderately and she hobbles around outside with the other dogs a little.

I called my vet yesterday and asked if she was confident that amputation was the right thing to do, based on what she knows about Katie.  She said “yes” without hesitation because she feels Katie is in a lot of pain now and it will only get worse.  And I can see that despite all of the pain meds she is on now, she is very miserable.  So I made the appointment for the amputation for 3 weeks from now.  I’m pretty sure at this point that I will go through with it.  I’m starting to feel like the options are to amputate asap or euthanize in the very near future.

My vet will do the surgery herself, and I feel that if she thought having an orthopedic surgeon do it would be better for Katie, she would say so.  At least I am about 95% sure that is the case.  I have been taking my pets to this vet for 15 years, so I do trust her.

But in the meantime I will explore the possibility of getting her into an Orthopedic Surgeon for evaluation.  But at this point I’m feeling better about trusting my Vet’s instincts over a Vet I don’t know at all.  She said that when Katie comes in for the surgery she will take more x-rays – lungs and I’m assuming all of her legs.  So I guess that will serve as an additional evaluation and if anything of great concern shows up then there may be a need to reevaluate plans.   

I’m near Albuquerque, NM.  There aren’t a lot of choices for specialists in ABQ.  My Vet had sent me to VCA a couple times in the past and I had one good experience and one bad there.  So I’m not particularly liking the idea of going back there. 

Thanks again.  I really appreciate the support and will keep you posted. 

The Rainbow Bridge



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25 November 2021 - 2:11 pm
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No such thing as TMI around here, more details the better.

Katie's situation happens to many dogs, unfortunately. Our own Jerry's story was quite similar too. A tumor was the furthest thing on our mind. But once that leg was gone, it was remarkable what a difference it made in his personality and abilities. Sure, things changed and he wasn't the super hiker that he was before, but that was OK by us if it meant we could have some quality time together before the cancer took over.

Your vet sounds great, and your relationship with her is golden, especially in a situation like this. We recommend specialists when the decision is tough and feels impossible to make, kind of like a tie-breaker. No, they won't know your dog as well as your vet, but they specialize in areas that general practice vets do not and can give you a more in-depth perspective on her candidacy as a Tripawd, if that's what you need to help you make the decision. Many people don't go the specialist route and that's fine too. 

I hope you and the pupperz are having a good, relaxing Thanksgiving holiday. Hang in there.

It's better to hop on three legs than to limp on four.™
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26 November 2021 - 10:10 am
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I’m feeling good about my plan now.  I’m assuming she will have the surgery on 12/16 and starting to make preparations.  I need to prepare myself for the possibility that the chest x-ray just before surgery will cause a change in plans, but for now I’m focusing on the preparations.  Since Katie hates change, the sooner I can make modifications the better so she can adjust before the surgery.  And I’m going to build her a wide, very solid ramp for my vehicle.

I’m glad I found this site, because if I hadn’t I may have made a bad decision or at least taken too long to make the right decision. 

Thanks so much for the support. 

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26 November 2021 - 11:41 am
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Can you guys direct me to the best forums for learning about tips for helping an amputee around in the beginning, and gear.  I'm trying to decide whether to buy a harness or not.  I have a Skijoring harness from a not so good idea many years ago.  It would probably fit Katie well, but I'm sure that a harness designed for a front leg amputee would be better.  But I'm wondering if a harness is the way to go vs just a strap, or a towell so I can help her around initially but that won't affect her comfort for sleeping.

The Rainbow Bridge



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26 November 2021 - 2:16 pm
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Since Katie hates change, the sooner I can make modifications the better so she can adjust before the surgery.

GREAT idea! Did you see our Tripawds Recovery Shopping List ? I think it will answer most of your questions about harnesses and ramps, etc.

I don't recommend the Skijoring harness unless it has a handle in a location similar to the The Ruffwear Flagline harness . We find it's ideal for a front-leg amputees because 1) you can slip it over their head and 2) where the handle is positioned on the body (closer to the middle). If you have  many stairs in your house, and it's the only way for her to get outside to potty, she can wear the harness after surgery if you put a t-shirt on her first. Otherwise we recommend waiting to use a harness until the stitches come out. A harness can also help you help her get into the car by using the handle to guide her in and out, and then you can skip the ramp altogether. 

I'm glad you are feeling more confident!

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Virginia




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26 November 2021 - 5:31 pm
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There's  actually a sense of relief  when you decide on a path forward.  You have done your research and you clearly  know uour sweet Katie and all her little "quirks" that make her so special  and adorable  and loveable😎   Your devotion to hernis so sweet.

Guess my only question  would be if the Bet could do the surgery any sooner?    If she's showing signs of pain now, it may get worse between now and then.  Otherwise, if it does get any worse you can ask the Vet about increasing  the meds.

Agree with Rene.  Love the idea of getting her acclimated  (as best you can😉) to some of the "tools' that will help facilitate  her recovery.  

Extra hugs

Sally and Alumni Happy Hannah and Merry Myrtle and Frankie too!

Happy Hannah had a glorious additional bonus time of over one yr & two months after amp for osteo! She made me laugh everyday! Joined April's Angels after send off meal of steak, ice cream, M&Ms & deer poop!

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26 November 2021 - 7:49 pm
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Thanks to both of you for the replies.  I had not seen the Shopping List, so thanks for that link and I will check it out.  The Flagline too.  I saw a very basic assistance wrap on Chewy that I may order now so I can get her used to it before the surgery. 

Yes, I do have a sense of relief, at least for now.  It helps that I can put my energy toward the preparations now.  Unfortunately, 12/16 is the earliest my vet can do it.  I wish it could be done sooner.  But, I guess that will give me plenty of time to prepare everything.  Plus, I'm having problems with my only vehicle, so need to make sure that is resolved. 

I sure hope Katie's pain doesn't get worse before the surgery.  I will certainly keep that thought in mind of asking for an increase in meds doses if needed.  I'm glad that she is being sensible about not moving around much.  I read the article about Patton breaking his leg the night before surgery (The Osteosarcoma Bone Cancer Fracture Risk is Real).  Scary!!

The Rainbow Bridge



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27 November 2021 - 10:43 am
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Glad that you're feeling better. I'm sure your vet is aware that this is a time-sensitive surgery but it can't hurt to remind the team and ask them if you can be put on a cancellation list.

Here's a DIY assistance sling you can make, and start practicing with this week.

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27 November 2021 - 12:59 pm
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Thanks for the DIY idea.  I think I have a couple canvas shopping bags somewhere and will try to find them.

I really would like to try to get Katie in before 12/16, but need to get my vehicle problem resolved before I put her in it.  It is quite hard to get a vehicle repaired in a timely manner around here these days.  Couldn't get in to my regular mechanic for 2 weeks so am going to someone new on Tues and just hoping for the best. 

Katie is having a bad day.  Very uncomfortable and I could only get her to eat a tiny bit this morning.  She had a pretty good day yesterday, including a good appetite so I'm hoping this is just a bad day.  If I don't give the meds with a large meal they do seem to really upset her stomach too, which compounds her discomfort and may lead to refusal to even eat what I hide the meds in.  If this keeps up I guess I will call my vet Monday to see if she can add something to settle Katie's stomach.  I suppose maybe I should try giving her a little rice or something like that?  I hate to after reading about carbs and cancer, but I guess I need to do whatever works for now.  She is extremely sensitive to changes in diet though, so trying something new is concerning.  I really doubt she would eat it anyway.

This is what I've been feeding the last week or so.  Nature's Logic canned, Primal and Vital Essentials freeze dried, fresh chicken, lightly cooked, a little bit of ground beef, raw (mostly to hide meds in).  It is similar to her previous diet except I eliminated the dry food, which had some grains (Farmina Ancient Grains and Victor) and am giving her a lot more chicken now.  I previously fed the chicken raw but am now cooking it a bit.  This morning the only thing she would eat was the chicken, maybe 2 spoonfuls of canned, a little Primal, and the usual small treats - ground beef balls with meds and 2 small spoonfuls of cream cheese.  She only ate these things because I gave them to her treat style - not in the bowl.

I really think it is the meds causing her upset stomach but maybe I should also cut back on any of the food that might be contributing.  Too much fat seems to disagree with her, so I probably should cut back even more on the ground beef.  Just enough to get the pills down.  Unfortunately, the ground beef is her favorite, and something that she will probably always eat.  So . . . I don't know.

These are the meds she is on now:  Carprofen 50 mg 2x  Tramadol 50 mg 2x  Gabapentin 100 mg 2x   Dasuquin.  The Carprofen prescription is for 100 mg 1x and I started out that way but I changed to 50 mg 2x a couple days ago because I could tell the effectiveness was waning before the next dose, and I thought half doses would mean less stomach upset.  Maybe my change was the wrong thing to do(?)

So, if you have any suggestions about pain meds and upset tummies I'm all ears.

The Rainbow Bridge



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27 November 2021 - 3:36 pm
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Oh yeah forgot about the car situation. I hope it can be fixed ahead of schedule. 

Don't worry about the carbs thing right now. The most important thing is to keep her eating so she is strong and able to recover as well as possible. If you want to do more reading about carbs and cancer, see:

Does a Low Carb Pet Cancer Diet Make a Difference?

Regarding the meds: Talk to your vet about the dosages, and the timing. I wouldn't change anything until you get their approval. The Gabapentin dosage is pretty low for a bigger dog experiencing this level of pain. Depending on what she weights it has room to go up. Ask your vet how much to increase. Newish studies show Tramadol is ineffective for this kind of pain. See if your vet can give you something stronger. This is serious pain and I'm betting that her weak appetite has a lot to do with how much she hurts.

Here are some appetite tips that can help boost her enthusiasm:

https://nutriti.....g/appetite

It's better to hop on three legs than to limp on four.™
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27 November 2021 - 8:38 pm
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Thanks so much for all of that.  I do remember reading the article about Tramadol when I was exploring Tripawds articles.  Thanks for the link so I can find it again.  That is troubling that my vet still uses it.

She improved during the day and ate pretty well tonight.  But still probably less than a quarter of what she used to eat.  But she ate enough that hopefully the meds won't upset her tummy so much.  I guess we just keep limping along and hopefully I will get a routine down that works.

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