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Need help today! -Dasatinib vs. Palladia vs. whatever
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7 July 2017 - 8:34 am
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So glad to hear your experience Amy, so, so glad !

This is such a crap disease, nobody seems to know which way to go and where to turn to, least of all us, pawrents who are not oncologists by profession …

I accepted Eurydice’s oncologist position and do not regret it.

When I took the decision to move onto holistic/palliative I stuck to it.

No way of knowing if that was or wasn’t the right decision.

I think we all have to decide on a course of action and do what we feel is better for our babies …

I hope with all my heart whichever the course of action will be for Manni will help him stay with us for a long time. 

All I can do is send all the positiveness me and Eurydice can master and we are doing it right now. 

We have fingers and toes firmly crossed for Manni ✊🏽🐮💫✨🌟🌹

Eurydice 77kg/170lb Great Dane limping end of April 2016, amputation (right front leg/osteosarcoma) 4 May 2016 6 courses of carboplatin followed by metronomic therapy, lung mets found 30 Nov 2016. 3 courses of doxorubicin, PET scan 26 Jan 2017 showed more mets so stopped chemo. Holistic route April 2017. Lung X-ray 5 May 2017 showed several tennis ball size mets, started cortisone and diuretics. Miss Cow earned her XXL silver wings 12 June 2017, 13 months and 1 week after amputation and 6 1/2 months after lung mets, she was the goofiest dawg ever and is now happily flying from cloud to cloud woof woofing away :-) 

Germany
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7 July 2017 - 10:07 am
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ok, long discussions at the clinic today. I didn’t know that Dasatinib has almost the same ingredients as Palladia. Palladia is better tested on pets though, Dasatinib is more widely used in humans but can be used as an alternative. According to our vets. I asked about a loooot of things including:

-surgery: if it’s a singular tumor, would it be an option? answer: high likelihood of recurrance and/ or other as of yet unseen mets, so no.

– Cortisone/Diuretics: no fluid whatsoever in the lungs yet, diuretics would effectively drain him dry. That’s for later.

-Vinorelbine (Navelbine): used in human lung cancer scenarios, BUT another vet clinic in Germany tested it and had no positive things to say.

-metronomic: a possibility, but likelihood of side-effects a lot higher if combined with palladia and at this stage not as likely to help as P.

-dendritic cell therapy: can be used in addition to whatever, does take quite some time though. ( this; I think, may be something for dogs with other cancers (especially reachable ones) in earlier stages, in case anyone’s interested)

-melatonin: this, according to my reading, is good for adding to treatment. I told the vets I will use it no matter what and that they should, please, look up dosage and times.

This leaves me, in my mind, with going the Palladia route. It is sitting on my kitchen counter right now, along with the rubber gloves. I am scared of it. I will administer the first dose tomorrow so the stomach pills have a chance to work first. At the first sign of side-effects I will stop giving it. 

There is one vet clinic in Central Germany that is the first in all of Europe to test a new kind of stereotactic radiation with which they can apparently treat extremely accurate. My vets will be in touch with them, if that is anything for us at all we might try it yet. It would make sense to combine it with the Palladia, though. 

As always, it comes down to the single most important issue: quality of life. I owe him so much, but this most of all. 

please keep us in your thoughts, we all know that this is the end. there is no miracle cure, although maybe the occasional miracle. thank you Amy, I think I needed that. 

I have no hope, I know better. But the only thing I need right now is the knowledge that this is not about me or my suffering, but all about Manni. I find consolation in the fact that he’s had a good life and that he would be dead already if he had stayed on the streets of Greece. I can smile when I look at him and he smiles back at me so all is good for now.

tina

Guardian of Manni the Wonderdog. -Or was it the other way around?
Osteo and amputation in Dec 2015. Second, inoperable, primary osteosarcoma found in June 2017.
The end of our adventures came Dec 10, 2017. 2 years to the day.

Manni's blog -dogblog-

Green Bay, WI
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7 July 2017 - 11:43 am
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Sending you strength to deal with the Paladia….don’t be afraid, this brings negative things your way. I was always told to wear gloves too with the daily oral chemo – I didn’t, just washed my hands afterwards. I’ve had 2 dogs now with chemo of various sorts, and really didn’t let it phase me. Sometimes I think there is a little bit of “overkill” with worry about it, and others may think I’m whacked for treating it this way, but it doesn’t scare me. I deal with it at work on a daily basis, and I’m still here after 30 years of being around it.

In my journey with this, all I’ve ever asked for is the strength, wisdom and courage to deal with whatever came my way….I’m asking this for you too.

Love you both,

Paula and Nitro

Nitro 11 1/2  yr old Doberman; right front amp June 2014. Had 6 doses carboplatin, followed by metronomic therapy. Rocked it on 3 legs for over 3 years! My Warrior beat cancer, but couldn't beat old age. He crossed the Bridge peacefully on July 25, 2017, with dignity and on his terms.  Follow his blog entitled "Doberman's journey"

http://nitro.tr.....27_2_1.jpg

"Be good, mama loves you".....run free my beautiful Warrior

Durham, NC
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7 July 2017 - 2:45 pm
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Ditto to what Paula said. I never wear gloves to administer the Palladia nor to wipe up Izzy’s (inevitable) piddle in the house and I haven’t grown a third eye or lost a finger or anything. (That said, I’m never having any kids, so I feel free to throw caution to the wind on many an occasion, explaining why I visited Puerto Rico at the height of the Zika virus scare!)

The prednisone makes her incontinent, but she’s on a healthy dose of it and has been taking it for a year, so that’s not an immediate side effect of the steroid.

Tina, Izzy is taking Vinblastine (IV administered by the onco – 1 mg bi weekly), 80 mg Palladia every other day, 15 – 20 mg of Prednisone daily, 20 mg Pepcid 2x daily (famotidine), Armor-Up (K9 Medicinals update to K9 Immunity Plus), doggy vitamins and a partridge in a pear tree. She did 5 days of palliative radiation in early April (I think?) as well, and it kicked in hardcore mid-May.

My point in listing all that out? Manni is much younger, much more active/in shape and so you needn’t worry … I hope he tolerates the meds as well as ancient Miss Izzy! 

Keep us posted! 🙂

Momma to the world's most beautiful American Bulldog, Izzy!! Lost her front leg to OSA 9/18/15. Diagnosed w MCT in June 2016. Celebrated her 1 year ampuversary with knee surgery on 9/18/16! MCT recurrence in Dec 2016. Happy & hungry til nearly 14, earning her wings on 7/31/17.

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7 July 2017 - 3:16 pm
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I am glad you were able to decide on what to try! We will keep you both in our thoughts and prayers!

Tina we all have a end like it or not! When? That is is anyones guess! The one thing we have learned from this stupid journey is to enjoy every minute we can, with everyone in our lives ! Never give up hope PLEASE!  You are letting the big C win!

Yes the lung mets suck and it is the end stage of the stupid disease! Others have lived for years with mets yes? So lets hope for a lot more quality time with Manni!! I sure am!!  The one thing cancer does do is allows us time to deal with all this and fight like he– ! To enjoy our animals even more!! So please don’t lose hope! Fight until we can fight no longer and then even then that stupid disease wont win! Why because we can help them not suffer and not let that disease take them! Your love for Manni will win this!!!

So get out there with that Manni Mobile and enjoy !!!

I am not consoling ok! Give this one heck of a fight and take one day at a time & HOPE!!!! 

Love & HUGS

Holly & Purrkinsheart

Virginia
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7 July 2017 - 3:23 pm
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Really helpful stuff AMY! Thank you AND Izzy for sharing! And about that third eye….look closely at some of the Va Pawty picutres!:-) 🙂 KIDDING!! 🙂 Nope, I never even got any special “cautionary” nstructions about any of Happy Hanna’s chemo stuff! Yeah, think it’s a lot of CYA!

And Tina, for whatever it’s worth….and I don’t usually say my what “I would do” (or think what I would do) if given the same situation and my dog was as good a shape as Manni…but I would go with the plan you’ve laid out…including the Melatonin!!

heartheart

Happy Hannah had a glorious additional bonus time of over one yr & two months after amp for osteo! She made me laugh everyday! Joined April's Angels after send off meal of steak, ice cream, M&Ms & deer poop!

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7 July 2017 - 7:34 pm
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I would consider either the Palladia or the dastinib although it is hard to predict side effects.  Some dogs do well and others have GI issues or low white counts.  We use mastinib in the US so I have no experience with cost or side effects of dastinib but I have had many pets do well on Palladia.

Pam

Virginia
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7 July 2017 - 9:03 pm
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No sweet Holly, you aren’t “consoling” or trying to “comfort” (although it’s what we ALL want to try to do because we love Mannie and Lisa so much). What you are doing is expressing how much you care in your own beautiful way.heart

heartheart

Sally and Alumni Happy Hannah and Merry Myrtle and Frankie too!

Happy Hannah had a glorious additional bonus time of over one yr & two months after amp for osteo! She made me laugh everyday! Joined April's Angels after send off meal of steak, ice cream, M&Ms & deer poop!

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8 July 2017 - 5:36 am
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As always, it comes down to the single most important issue: quality of life. I owe him so much, but this most of all. 

This has always been your guide and always will be, Tina. Manni is so, so lucky to have you. And that is not consoling; it’s just a fact. As always, I admire the thoroughness of your research and your total commitment to doing what’s best for Manni.

I hope you are taking good care of yourself, as well. You are, of course, in my thoughts.

Much love,

Meg, Clare and Elsie Pie heartheartheart

Meg, Mutt, aged around 9, adopted 31/12/2009. Sudden explosive right elbow fracture 06/12 (caused by IOHC), diagnosed with End Stage Arthritis 03/15, Total Elbow Replacement 08/15, problems with healing leading to skin graft & skin flap surgery, Chronic Infection leading to implant breakdown. Became a Tripawd 9th March 2016. 
Lives with Mum, Clare, watched over by Angel Pie and Angel Billie
My life as a MEG-A-STAR 


The Rainbow Bridge

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8 July 2017 - 8:38 am
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tazziedog said
 but I have had many pets do well on Palladia.

Pam  

Pam, how/when is Palladia administered? Time of day? Wearing gloves? Can it contaminate other pets via fecal matter or urine of the patient? Just curious. Thanks.

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8 July 2017 - 8:42 am
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tinsch said
I have no hope, I know better. But the only thing I need right now is the knowledge that this is not about me or my suffering, but all about Manni. I find consolation in the fact that he’s had a good life and that he would be dead already if he had stayed on the streets of Greece. I can smile when I look at him and he smiles back at me so all is good for now.

tina  

Tina, I truly admire your ability to cope, to move forward with a plan while not allowing your grief to bog you down and delay whatever treatment that you want to pursue for him. To me, that is absolutely putting Manni’s interest first.

{{{{hugs}}}}}

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Virginia
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8 July 2017 - 9:28 am
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And btw…I KNOW you are TINA and not LISA!!! GEEZ!!

And Manni has no clue there are any cconcerns and certainly isn’t thinking about the “end” of anything! Only we silly humans waste energy like that. Manni is just continuing to live each moment to the fullest and feeding off of your positive energy.

As you said: “All is good for now.” And if that changes, you will deal with it. There are so many ways to “put Manni first”. One way you are doing so well is by not letting the negative energy of dread and worry about the “end” take you away from the power of the living he is doing now! Nope, Manni thrives on his life with you right now and your loving and fun energy and he sure isn’t letting anything get in his way!

Lots of love

PS…Tina, because I know you have such a great sense of humor, even during the rough times, I HAVE to point out the obvious! I do think you’ll get a little “chuckle”laughing. DO you see how everyone is trying sooooo hard to honor your rewuest NOT to “console”?? The restraint is palpable!!!way-cool It’s pretty much like telling this group to NOT breathe!!!

Happy Hannah had a glorious additional bonus time of over one yr & two months after amp for osteo! She made me laugh everyday! Joined April's Angels after send off meal of steak, ice cream, M&Ms & deer poop!

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8 July 2017 - 10:12 am
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As always: thanks, people.

Sally, I WAS actually getting a small chuckle out of the not-consoling bit and I love your “telling them not to breathe” bit. That’s actually hilarious. 

We started on the Palladia today and I feel we’re already too late. While he was coughing this week at night when we went to bed, he now progressed to coughing even during the day. Not all the time and not in a bad way but it is really scary how fast this crap is happening. I know about cough medicines and all that and we have the next (phone) appointment on Tuesday. 

There really is nothing to admire about me, I am scrambling to get my bearings. I just always felt that there’s no point in stagnating, I will have enough time to cry in the months to come. 

I am now praying very very hard for no side-effects, the guilt of that would be hard to bear. Since he’s become a lot more attached I will not leave him for a minute and I am hoping there’s still gonna be a lot of minutes. The vet said something about a probable 2-3 months but considering how fast everything’s changing I find that extremely optimistic. But again: it doesn’t matter right now. Manni matters. His quality of life matters. 

I am sorry I haven’t been more active on the site lately. Holly, I am sorry I have not even found it in me to jump over to your lovely blog and Masha, if you read this: if you need me, I’ll still be there.

I know you’re all there. I know you care. It is appreciated, trust me. We’re just doing the best we can right now.

Right now that looks something like this and I would like to point out my dog’s very decent table manners:

Guardian of Manni the Wonderdog. -Or was it the other way around?
Osteo and amputation in Dec 2015. Second, inoperable, primary osteosarcoma found in June 2017.
The end of our adventures came Dec 10, 2017. 2 years to the day.

Manni's blog -dogblog-

Virginia
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SLURP!!! SLURP!!!! I love those sounds!! And Manni REALLY does have good table manners! If he has a spoill he immediately picked it ul! And he was quite masterful had keeping his cup of ice cream upright. And I love how he glanced up at rhe camera periodically maybe to make sure the camera wasn’t going to try and get any! 🙂

And yes, the cough medicine really does seem to help when a cough is present. For whatever reason, Happy Hannah never developed a cough, but I’ve seen others on here have good results. If you want to do something before Tuesday, search the site as it seems like I recall even some over the cojnter human cough medicines were jsed. Could be completely wrong though.

AND I was just reviewing another post a while back with someone using Palladia and Cerenia was given pretty consistently. You probably already knkw that, but it did seem to help to dogs did experience nausea.

You KNOW we have to have more Manni videos and pictures!! When see videos like this it’s such a good reminder of what the NOW is like for Manni! The bliss of being dog!! 🙂

The name escapes me right now, even though I can visualize the dog, but it was one of the best quotes! The dog developed a met and was getting massive amounts of every “forvidden” junk food a dog good ever hope for! The thought bubvle for the dog was that she was thinking mets were the best thing ever! If we could all only xee things from a dog’s perspective!! 🙂

Lots of love!

Sally and Alumni Happy Hannah and Merry Myrtle and Frankie too!

Happy Hannah had a glorious additional bonus time of over one yr & two months after amp for osteo! She made me laugh everyday! Joined April's Angels after send off meal of steak, ice cream, M&Ms & deer poop!

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8 July 2017 - 8:03 pm
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Jerry, our local oncologist uses Palladia a lot and I do not think time of day matters.  I have not seen people instructed to wear gloves. Main side effects are on the stomach but few people stop it.  I have not noted low white counts but that has been reported.  It is pricey but since it is oral there is no charge for IV catheter or fluids like with other chemo drugs.

Pam

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