Caring for a Three Legged Dog or Cat
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Our vet has been talking with the oncologist at Georgia Veterinary Specialists. We have an appointment to go over there next Thursday. But their initial recommendation is for Spencer to do five 3 week chemo cycles. So once per week for 15 weeks. And they are talking about using vincristine, adriamycin, cytoxan.
Looking around on here it seems like this is 1) a really long period for the chemo. It seems like 8 is about the norm on this page. Also, I haven't found anyone else doing these 3 together.
Spencer's lymph nodes came back clean. His lungs have been clear on x-ray so far. I hope to get an ultrasound scheduled for next week to be sure of his spleen and liver (we moved really fast on the amputation and didn't even wait for further testing because we knew that if he had any chance the leg had to come off, so there was no reason to leave the tumor there any extra time).
I'm thinking that if any thing shows on the liver or spleen we will likely totally pass on chemo. If they come back clean I'm more conflicted though. Our vet is confident that they got the entire tumor; but can't say that at the celular level it hadn't already spread.
But on the flip side, he did warn that one of the chemo meds can cause heart disease. I hate to fix one problem only to cause another!
Anyone know about these 3 meds? How hard they will likely be on him?
Ugh. he really seems to be FINE now. He is 2 weeks post amputation and doing great. There is nothing to indicate that he is sick at all, except for that there was the tumor. (it was a level 3 fibrosarcoma). It grew very fast and we are confident that we got it very early.
But I honestly don't think I want to do 4 months of chemo to only buy a total of say 6 months. (6 months including those 4 months of chemo). I'd rather have him with a quality of life - which he has right now - and then possibly have to put him to sleep rather than have him sick from chemo for 4 months and having to stay overnight at the vet once per week (he has separation anxiety; but 2 of the chemo meds are IV and he would apparently be staying overnight) and then still have the cancer come back.
And then there is always the chance that the surgery was a "curative surgery". And for that there is just no way to know until we go a year or more with no new tumors...
Advice? Thoughts?
Jac and Angel Spencer. Spencer was 5.25 years old. He fought a grade 3 fibrosarcoma, started on his shoulder. Left front leg amputated in August 2011. 15 weeks of chemo finished 12/22/11 (mytox and adria). Lung mets found on x-rays 12/28/11. Started carboplatin 1/6/12. Went to Heaven on 2/27/12. I miss him like crazy every day. See his blog here: http://spencer.tripawds.com/
Just to clarify, Spencer does not have osteosarcoma?
From abandoned puppy to Tripawd Warrior Dude, Dakota became one of the 2011 February Furballs due to STS. Our incredibly sweet friend lived with grace and dignity till he impulsively raced over the Bridge on 12-15-12.
Dakota's thoughtful and erudite blog is at http://shari.tr.....pawds.com/
well, we did five rounds (once every three weeks) of doxorubicin, which is the generic of adriamycin. gayle had a grade three soft tissue sarcoma in her right front wrist. there were a few bad days during rounds three and four, but only a few. for the most part, it wasn't an awful experience, and we do believe it helped prolong her life. there are drugs available for the nausea, which we found out about after round three, and helped with the remainder. if you start chemo, and it seems too tough on spencer, you can always stop. several folks have not completed the cycle, due to financial, GI or other issues. if you have clean scans of the liver and spleen, and clear chest films, they that's a great starting point. only you know what is right for your dog, and whatever you decide, as long as your love for spencer guides your decision, it's the right thing to do. we support your right to do what's best.
charon & gayle
Life is good, so very, very good!!! Gayle enjoyed each and every moment of each and every wonderful day (naps included). She left this world December 12, 2011 – off on a new adventure.
Love Never Ends
Many of the osteosarcoma dogs get carboplatin (my Yoda did), which is supposed to be the safest of the chemo drugs, I think. But maybe it's not recommended for fibrosarcoma. Sure does sound like they want to take an aggressive approach. Sorry that's all the input I've got. These treatment decisions, I always thought, are the worst. Good luck!
Gerry has been a tripawd since 12/16/2009.
He was a shelter dog with a mysterious past and an irrepairable knee injury.
Videos and pics of Gerry's pawesomeness can be found at: http://gerry.tripawds.com
Dakota Dawg said:
Just to clarify, Spencer does not have osteosarcoma?
nope. Spencer has fibrosarcoma, which is a soft tissue sarcoma.
Jac and Angel Spencer. Spencer was 5.25 years old. He fought a grade 3 fibrosarcoma, started on his shoulder. Left front leg amputated in August 2011. 15 weeks of chemo finished 12/22/11 (mytox and adria). Lung mets found on x-rays 12/28/11. Started carboplatin 1/6/12. Went to Heaven on 2/27/12. I miss him like crazy every day. See his blog here: http://spencer.tripawds.com/
Gayle, your story really makes me feel more inclined to do the chemo, or at least some type. I have to really find out why they want to do all 3 meds and why so many treatments. But that you are still going at 18 months... well I'd take that! I just don't want to do four months of chemo, with him miserable, and then end up having to put him to sleep shortly after that.
Another question about chemo... it sounds like their fur doesn't grow back well when on it? So since we would be starting before Spencer's fur has grown back from the surgery (and actually we shaved a spot on his other side too to better see a spot that turned out to be some sort of trauma), does that mean that he would likely not grow his fur back until after the 4 months of chemo was done? I know it is totally cosmetic; but I'm really looking forward to him having his fur back so that it doesn't jump out at everyone right away that he just had this surgery (since he has light skin and dark fur, his shaved spot is very obvious. And it is very big).
Jac and Angel Spencer. Spencer was 5.25 years old. He fought a grade 3 fibrosarcoma, started on his shoulder. Left front leg amputated in August 2011. 15 weeks of chemo finished 12/22/11 (mytox and adria). Lung mets found on x-rays 12/28/11. Started carboplatin 1/6/12. Went to Heaven on 2/27/12. I miss him like crazy every day. See his blog here: http://spencer.tripawds.com/
it took a little while for gayle's hair to grow back, i'm not sure it was due to the chemo, but it was probably several months or so post-amputation before it came back all the way. at first, it was slightly 'wirey' (she is mostly black lab), but it eventually just all blended in and is now beautiful (of course i'm biased...). she's since had her belly shaved twice for sonograms and that's grown in fine too. the chemo for our pups isn't as harsh as the stuff humans get, so there usually isn't the associated hair loss. i think in poodles and maybe afghans and dogs that have more 'hair' than fur, there is hair loss, but not like in humans. don't fret the hair, i don't think that will be a major issue....
charon & gayle
Life is good, so very, very good!!! Gayle enjoyed each and every moment of each and every wonderful day (naps included). She left this world December 12, 2011 – off on a new adventure.
Love Never Ends
My pug Maggie had mast cell cancer- so the regimen was different than what your oncologist is recommending. If you are interested you can read the details of the meds and the sequence in her blog.
Maggie's chemo lasted about 6 months- with a treatment every other week. I chose to do chemo for her in part because I expected the amputation to be curative. Pre-amp tests showed no spread of the mast cell cancer, which tends to go to the spleen, liver, bone marrow, and the lymph system. After surgery the lymph node removed with the leg was dissected and found to contain lots of cancerous mast cells indicating the cancer had already spread. WITH chemo Mag was given 6 to 9 months. I think because of the prognosis the chemo was designed to be more palliative- not so aggressive. We started each drug with a low dose, and slowly increased until some symptoms were seen. Then we backed off to the dose that did not cause side effects (or minimal side effects). My oncologist's goal was to give Mag as much time as possible- but not to sacrifice life quality. Maggie tolerated the chemo pretty well, a little nausea and some fatigue. Turns out Maggie beat the odds and lived almost 4 years after her amputation- and she did not pass from the mast cell cancer.
I would talk with your oncologist about what the goal of treatment is, and how the doses will be determined. If the side effects are too much for Spencer you can always stop chemo.
I will add that during her last year Maggie developed kidney failure. I don't think there is anyway to determine what caused it, but I suspect that her chemo treatments (and the other meds she took) may have contributed. The oncologist does not think the chemo contributed- but not many dogs live as long as Maggie did after her treatment so I don't think it has been studied much. If I had known that kidney failure was a risk 3 years later it would not have changed my mind- I didn't think we would get one year. I do not regret the decision to do chemo at all.
Good luck with you oncology consult and making your decision.
Karen and the pugapalooza
Hi,
My Rio also had mast cell cancer. And she had vinblastine with both rounds of her chemo. Vinblastine and vincristine are both vinca alkaloids with the same types of side effects. Rio had low white cell counts initially, and some on-going lethargy with both rounds of chemo (you can read the details on our blog), plus some stomach upset (nasty burps, a little diahrrea, and some super bad gas, but no vomiting). That was the extent of her side effects. The GI issues were treated with additional medications, and she took antibiotics in case of secondary infections. But all in all, she made it through her chemo just fine.
Remember, the chemo doses administered to our dogs are super low and not intended to CURE but to simply knock back the cancer a bit. It's nothing like the doses that they throw at human cancer patients. And as Gayle pointed out, if your pup doesn't handle the chemo well, you can always stop.
Whatever you choose, it's the right decision for you and your dog and your circumstances. We wish you all the best!
Rio's mom and Rio
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~ ~ Rio ~ ~ |
The chemo plan for your dog is common for aggressive soft tissue sarcomas. Adriamycin is the drug that is hard on the heart muscle and since male Dobes are at higher risk for dilated cardiomyopathy anyway I would make sure to do an echocardiogram (ultrasound of the heart) first. Most dogs tolerate this drug combo very well although some may get nausea or diarrhea and Cytoxan can cause an inflamed bladder.
As far as hair regrowth I have always had good luck with a mushroom supplement such as Power Mushrooms or K9 Immunity . I would ask your oncologist first since some don't like dogs to have supplements until chemo is finished.
Pam
Sidnerella is slated to start her chemo regimen next week if her white blood cell count is not high anymore. They have planned for 6 rounds, 3 weeks apart of alternating carboplatin and adriamycin and then pyroxicam daily for 90 days. She has a fairly rare form of fibrosarcoma and HEMANGIOPERICYTOMA. it took several vet school labs and 4 weeks of immune-fluorescence staining to finally pin down there best guess. What we do know is that it is poorly differentiated and highly mitotic. Her chest and abdominal studies are negative and bloodwork and chemistry is normal except for a post surgical infection she is recovering from.
Gayle - you mentioned anti-nausea meds? Sid has been wonderful except that her appetite has really suffered. Initially from the pyroxicam and augmentin and then from the infection. she has been a true garbage disposal for 11.5 years. To see her completely refuse food for much of 10 days was gut wrenching. Still she wanted to chase a ball and hang out with her pack most days.
It makes it difficult to want to turn right around after finally getting her to eat just 3 days ago to starting chemo next week. Can y'all share a little about how you combat the nausea? How long does it last usually, and what is it like between chemo rounds?
I share the last posters concern about doing the right thing. There are so many unknowns it becomes a giant balancing act.
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