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electrochemotherapy?
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Member Since:
4 December 2013
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26 June 2015 - 7:36 pm
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Hello,

Ok so a bit of a side not to amputation, but CA related but maybe potentially helpful for MCT or STS that could result in amputation. I have been reading about electrochemotherapy which seem really promising. Has anyone done it, or know any locations in the midwest. So far Ive only found 3 locations in the US... being new york on the top, then Calif. and newest Missouri. Missouri is closer to me but it seems like they have the least experience as the oncologist stated, its "new" to them.

Im trying to treat my dogs STS not related to her original dx of OSA and ampuation in 2013. And with her limited options due to already having 3 legs, this treatment seems really promising with minimal side effects. They are already using it on people and Ive spoken via email to someone in Australia and apparently almost all of the oncology vets offer it. sucks we are behind on something that seems could help so much, and is expensive but within attainable cost.

Me and my girl are in Illinois.

Angel Neka

7/4/2003-4/5/2016

2.5yr 3x cancer warrior survivor

On The Road


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27 June 2015 - 9:29 am
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Hmm, this isn't something i'm familiar with. Do you have any links to share?

Tripawds Founders Jim and Rene
tripawds.com | tripawds.org | bemoredog.net | triday.pet

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28 June 2015 - 8:16 pm
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Yes, Ill give some links but to help sum it up. Its using regular chemo therapy so far cistplatin and bleomycin  have so far been studied. So you use regular chemo in injection form or (i think regular IV) and they use electrode probes/plates or needles to open up the cell membrane to trigger local uptake of the chemo therapy thus allow for local control and in some cases eradication of the mass. it can be repeated if necessary if the tumor regrow. It has been used all across Australia for melanomas in both people and dogs There have been "studies" since 1998, 2002, 2008 and Im sure others inbetween. from what Ive read, no one has really followed through with continued research or started their own trails consistently in order to get full research. but it seems super promising. I spoke with this lady in Australia and she said almost all of the oncologist there offer it. Make you wonder then why arent we? It seem to have minimal side effects, but is still currently deemed "experimental", however the results and journals all seem to have really good results, if not cured, definitely controlled.

So far Ive only found locations who offer it in NY, CA, Missouri, and seattle,washington, (I think)Supposedly Dr Tripp from seattle  pioneered it for the west coast and trained many others.

I cant remember if I saw that Dr Sue Ettinger from new york does it or not, That is my next contact to see what her suggestion is or any more insight on it.

Univ is close to me, but the oncologist I spoke with stated it was new to them and wasnt sure if the "probes" could reach Neka(my dog) deep residual dirty margins, but from what Ive read it seems that it could be good for that, so I was confused, hence needing to do more research. I dont know if its because they arent as experience or exactly the reason.  I did read that different plates/probes and needles can be used depending on the type of tumor. The treatments are anywhere from 1-4 to start and only about 10mn long...

I hate to get too excited and get let down but man this seems super promising. I have already contacted my oncologist, and the U of I who Ive had consults with previously and neither had any suggestions. I find this somewhat disappointing since it seem to be something up and comming.

Heres some links:

 

http://caninech.....in-horses/

http://www.vcsc.....cians/cipy

http://onlineli.....117.x/epdf

http://www.rese.....rPage=true

http://www.vete.....Treatment/

 

Heres also a study about how a colon was treated   in Ireland: with pics

http://www.vete.....Treatment/

Angel Neka

7/4/2003-4/5/2016

2.5yr 3x cancer warrior survivor

Member Since:
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28 June 2015 - 8:19 pm
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Angel Neka

7/4/2003-4/5/2016

2.5yr 3x cancer warrior survivor

On The Road


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29 June 2015 - 9:38 am
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Hey thanks for sharing all of this info. It's odd that in all our years of talking to oncologists we've never had one bring this up. I think one possible reason is just that there hasn't been enough research to really blow statistics out of the water and get more oncos on board with doing it. Oncos tend to go with what's been most successful larger numbers of animals, so I'm guessing this is why we don't hear it talked about.

But it's a GREAT topic for us to explore in the blog, and in fact we just had an oncologist from Sage Centers on Tripawd Talk Radio (he never mentioned it but then again we weren't getting into that level of detail). I'm going to send him the link you posted about Penny and ask if he can provide more details about why it's not widely offered in the U.S., so stay tuned. And thanks for enlightening us about this.

Tripawds Founders Jim and Rene
tripawds.com | tripawds.org | bemoredog.net | triday.pet

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29 June 2015 - 3:40 pm
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thank you. yeah I figured its because that it does seem the studies are blotchy over the years, but I did find it interesting that when I spoke with the lady in Australia she was surprised because it was a "norm' for them. I am trying to find out as much as I can in a short time frame because I am trying to find someone that feels comfortable with their procedure to have it done on my Neka, but I am running into a lot of road blocks. (aside from driving 13 hrs to new York for the lady that has done alot of them) which BTW I am considering. uug)13 hr drive for a 10mn procedure. ..lol.. I had a dif  place in NY for a trial at a univ and the tech. said I had to give $375 phone consult to just talk to him about the procedure and indicators. I was like Mann that's steep.

 

her tumor was removed in April and has had 2 rounds of doxi, but we havnt done anything for the local regrowth so I feel like im on time constraints to act quickly to be the most effective. Plus Im suppose to go back to school in Aug and would like to get a jump on it, ive already postponed everything to help treat her, but Im trying to do it all.. of course..uug. ok rambling.

 

Steph & Neka

Angel Neka

7/4/2003-4/5/2016

2.5yr 3x cancer warrior survivor

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13 July 2015 - 10:15 pm
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Another study with pics of the successes of ECT on a peri-anal abscess.

 

http://www.rese.....emotherapy

Angel Neka

7/4/2003-4/5/2016

2.5yr 3x cancer warrior survivor

On The Road


Member Since:
24 September 2009
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14 July 2015 - 9:09 am
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Hi Steph, how is she doing? She looked so GREAT on the Fourth of July! We have our paws crossed that she  keeps on rockin.

Have you considered referring her case to Colorado State University's Argus Institute? They will consult on a donation basis and may be able to tell you whether electrochemotherapy is something for her or to go another route.

Tripawds Founders Jim and Rene
tripawds.com | tripawds.org | bemoredog.net | triday.pet

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14 July 2015 - 8:10 pm
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Hello jerry,

Yes my girl is still doing great!!.She was so happy on the 4th and her birthday..:).. its just the silent left over CA cells that have my mind whirling.

I actually did get ahold of Dr. Chelsea Tripp from washington State, shes kind of the spokes person for the ECT on the west coast and has traveled speaking about it too. Shes been doing it for about 5 yrs and learned directly from the source(I forget the dr name). She felt that my girl was a candidate but, there is some uncertainty if ECTcould reach all the cells on the "deeper" level, but she said itd be worth a try,  and she gave me some insight on how shed approach it. Unfortunately I cant just drive to Washington,(man I wish I could!!) but she said shed be willing to consult with Univ of missouri, (its just they are very new at it, a bit under 2 yrs) Ive talked with them and of course they are pushing radiation because its definite, but I also wonder if the hesitation is just because of the lack of studies on the ECT.

The oncologist I spoke with at univ of missouri has only treated 3 tumors in 2 yrs, made me nervous, but he was the radiation specialist, so I am contacting one of their medical oncologist, to yet again, explain my girls case and what Ive discussed with Dr Tripp. So more phone calls, and I hope to have it scheduled in the next week or so. Its about a 6hr drive for us, so I want everything in order before I head out. Dr Tripp said shed recommend 2 treatments 1 week apart so I will also discuss that with Univ of Mo.

I just hope Im making the right decision, its like if I know the radiation will definite kill the cells but yet Im choosing to do this new procedure  with similar results, but with some unknowns yet with little to no immediate side effects and only about 15mn procedure. At about half or less the cost of definite radiation. I just don't want to loose all my funds (CC limits..lol) in case she has costs I have to cover in the future.

At this point I just need to make the face to face consult and see how I feel with the people that are going to perform the procedure, I guess I can always walk away if Im not comfortable... its only a 6 hr drive...lol I get myself so nauseated and worked up over these decisions, mostly because they are life changing decisions that are left in my hands, and there can be a wrong decision, that decisions could affect her outcome. uug

Man wish I had the funds to go to washington.

Ok rambled enough.

Angel Neka

7/4/2003-4/5/2016

2.5yr 3x cancer warrior survivor

On The Road


Member Since:
24 September 2009
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15 July 2015 - 10:13 am
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Oh my gosh you don't ramble at all, this is SUPER valuable info and will help someone in the future who is looking for the same info. Really can't thank you enough for pursuing it and sharing your findings here. If at some point you'd like to write a guest blog post about your experience with this treatment, we'd be so grateful.

Meanwhile, have you talked to Dr. Kim Selting at Mizzou? She's one of the oncology dept. heads and she loves Tripawds, so maybe you can make some pawgress with her.

Remember there are no wrong decisions here. Everything you do for her is an act of love and she knows that. Even "right" decisions can have outcomes nobody expected, it's like trying to know what the future is, impossible. So all you can do is your best, and she knows that you are. All she wants is your happiness 🙂

Tripawds Founders Jim and Rene
tripawds.com | tripawds.org | bemoredog.net | triday.pet

Member Since:
4 December 2013
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20 July 2015 - 4:22 pm
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oh my gosh.. I just made an appointment with her for next tues then I saw this post..lol....trying to see if I might push it to monday.. but I guess whats one more day...lol.. man does my OCD kick in.. ironically, im only that way with my pets...lol.. I am so nervous.. mostly because I want it to work.. a part of me is like, should I just do the radiation...uug...they know the results from that.. a sure kill, well at least thats what they tell me... the other part of me is like this could work too.. problem is lack of studies and approach...I feel shes too healthy to take chances and sit back and just do palliative..I mean lungs, and the rest of her is great!!!...Dr Tripp from Washington stated she has used it on high grade STS and has had a 9 month success rate, on average.. to me that doesnt seem long.. but I suppose its hard to say, each case is so unique.. Im hoping because her location was so fleshy and shallow.. the "deep" areas can be reached successfully. As that was a bit of a concern. Itll be a long week to wait..uug.

Thanks again.. this has been so helpful for me to just ramble and write it all out. Not having others around you that really understand the effort and the "why's" we do this for our fur loved ones..Its hard for people to understand the cost and deep hearted love we invest into these guys. But ive always said.. its our job. we took them on, our earth and actions most likely created these cancer mutating cells, the least we can do is help them to the best of our ability.. ..Ok, totally off topic..lol.

 

here some more cool pics..studies...warning.. Graphic!!

http://petcance.....ectvet.htm

Angel Neka

7/4/2003-4/5/2016

2.5yr 3x cancer warrior survivor

On The Road


Member Since:
24 September 2009
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30 July 2015 - 10:15 am
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WOW how did I miss this, I'm so sorry! I saw yesterday's blog post just now and I'm hopping over there to check it out. So excited for you guys!

http://nekasjou.....1-post-op/

And yes, we totally get it. Nobody here will ever question your decisions or judge, we all understand that everyone's story is different but the one thing we have in common is the same dedication to these animals who give so much and ask for so little in return.

Tripawds Founders Jim and Rene
tripawds.com | tripawds.org | bemoredog.net | triday.pet

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