Caring for a Three Legged Dog or Cat
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My Rottweiler named Major is 8 1/2 years old and recently started limping. We took him to the vet and found out he has osteosarcoma in his front elbow. I immediately purchased Apocaps , K9 immunity , K9 trans factor, Fish Oil and putting him on Diet recommended by Cancer Guide book. I also have ordered Essiac tea that we will start giving him as well.
We decided to also do amputation and chemo and it was very tough for my wife and I to drop him off for the surgery. Then the bad news...X-rays came back with golf ball size tumor in lungs and it looks like 2 other tumors are in lungs as well. He also thinks there may be a tumor elsewhere in body that we haven't found yet where all of this started out due to the size of tumors. The oncologist said we should just concentrate on pain management and not amputate due to tumors already spreading and due to the size chemo won't help. We then decided to do radiation therapy for pain...again we dropped him off at on oncologist and while he was there a bone chipped and he is doing worse. The doctor said he has a 50/50 chance of this helping and he is only done 1 session. Due to this chipped bone he really can't walk and I had to carry him to bed and out of bed last night. I'm Heartbroken watching him not be able to get around. (This is day one of this pain for him...the bone chip happened yesterday).
So the question I have is if I truly believe we have a shot of the "holistic" approach helping since we can't do chemo should we amputate the leg and put him through the pain associated with surgery or should we come to the realization we may not be able to do anything? I don't know if I'm thinking correctly about this right now and would appreciate feedback. I’m leaning on taking a chance on amputation cause I can’ t face that we may be out of options.
Zac
Welcome, your future forum posts will not require moderation. We've also moved your topic from the Tech Support forum where you posted here to Share Your Story, where many more members are likely to see your post.
It sounds like you have been very thorough with your treatment decisions so far, major is lucky to have you. While amputation will not "cure" the cancer, it will eliminate the pain of the tumor, which will eventually cause the leg to break. We are not vets, but we have interviewed many, and we can speak from experience. The pain of amputation recovery may last 2-3 weeks if Major is a fit dog. Our Jerry survived another 9± months after we discovered his lung metastasis approx. 14 months after his amputation.
If Dr Dressler's Dog Cancer Survival Guide is the guide book you refer to, then you are following some of the best advice available. But every dog is different. Only you, Major, and your veterinary team can determine the appropriate path.
For more helpful links, be sure to bookmark Jerry's Required Reading List and for immediate answers to the most common concerns consider downloading Tripawds e-books .
Thanks for joining and best wishes for Major. Please keep us posted.
Tripawds Founders Jim and Rene
tripawds.com | tripawds.org | bemoredog.net | triday.pet
Goah Zac, my heart is breaking for you and your wife. You are in an incredibly touch situation, that's for sure. Nothing about this stupid disease is easy.
You seem to have a pretty good grasp on what's best for your pup. No one knows your dog better than you. You also want to assess your own thought processes ......will you second guess yourself if you do NOT go forward with the amputation and plague yourself with "what ifs" questions. And, of course, the reverse is true if you go forward with the amp. and aren't able to get extended quality time.
Is he...up to this point...showing no other signs of "ill health"? He's been eating, alert, happy, lots of tail wags?
Did your onco discuss metronomics with you? Yes, Zac, there are dogs who have gotten extended quality time even with lung mets. and, as you already kow, this whole journey is about extended quality time
The fact that he has the vone chip is efinitely ramping up the urgency to free him from pain as best as possible. The pain meds will help with that too.
I can oly tell you that there was a recent link here directingnyou to an onco who, years ago did NOT encourage amputation if lung mets were present. NOW, however, she has changed her position and DOES recommend amputation in spite of lung mets. Assuming all goes well with the surgery and after the two-three week recoverh (some feeling better soner, some a bit longer), Being pain free is pretty much a guarantee!
As far as getting around on three legs, your pup was already just using three legs once the limp started! So you already know he can handle that just fine!
I'm so sorry this is happening and, whatever decision you make, it will be the right one because it will be one made out of love! Right ow, yo are all together and he isn't worried about any stupid diagnosis or statistic! He sounds like a strong wnderful dog with a lot of determination! And that is a plus that no statistic understands! He doesn't have a time frame stamped on his head!
Please kow we are all here for you. As alone as you must feel, know that we are right by your side. You are not alone.
You are clearly devoted and committed to give him the best possible chance at quality. You are a wonderul advocate.
Surrounding you with clarity and the magic of healing compassion,
Sally and Happy Hannah
Happy Hannah had a glorious additional bonus time of over one yr & two months after amp for osteo! She made me laugh everyday! Joined April's Angels after send off meal of steak, ice cream, M&Ms & deer poop!
This is tough news. Really tough. Is the bone chip in the limb that would be amputated? If it is, that makes things a little easier - you'd be removing the tumor-pain and bone chip-pain. If not, amputating would just put more pressure on an already tender, painful area. Amputating is to remove pain and return a quality of life, but if in your pup's case, amp'ing could cause more pain (this is if the bone chip isn't in the "disposable" limb).
The stats are not great for a dog's long-term survival if there are already mets in the body. That said, tumors tend to be more slow in older dogs. How's his spirit? It sounds likes things are pretty rough over there. Does he still express a love of life, or is he in too much pain? Can he breathe well? Might there be a reason to xray him a week out and compare tumor growth? That may give you an idea how to progress. From the sound of things, it appears there's a lot against your pup right now. You can always have HOPE, but if your pup is in too much pain, can't get around well, can't breathe well (b/c of mets), then palliative care may be best. Or as Sally points out - look in to metronomic therapy! It's relatively cheap and it's a daily medicine you give at home. That way, you can hang with your best friend, watch his quality of life, and forget about trips back/forth and for hours at the vet. Lots of us have tried or are using metronomic therapy (Jackson has been on it for 7 months).
Talk it over with Major. See what he wants - trips to the vet? A loss of limb? What does he have the strength for? You guys know him best!
Jackson is also on an Essiac blend! We get it from Only Natural Pet, their BSST formula. That, along with so many other lucky factors, I believe are helping to keep Jackson fighting this war.
Keep us posted. Sending LOADS of HUGS your way. This is a really awful situation. My heart aches for you.
~ Katy & Jackson
ACL tear in right hind leg 12/5/12 and scheduled ACL repair surgery 12/21/12. Pre-op xrays revealed osteosarcoma. Amputation 12/28/12. Chemo (carboplatin) started Jan 10, 2013 and ended on April 5, for a total of 5 doses. He handled carbo like a champ! No side effects. We started metronomic therapy at his third chemo and have been also doing some holistic treatments. He's a lively, playful 10 year old huskie-boarder collie and a very proud member of the Winter Warriors! Our love. Our funny little guy!
I am not a fan of holistic medicine for cancer. It simply does not work. Ask Steve Jobs how that turned out. Sorry to be grim, but the truth is on my side.
If you had the cash, I would amputate and forgo chemo. The amputation will stop the pain better than anything you can feed him... even the radiation will not be as effective as the amputation.
Sorry that you have to face such grim times... but put the dog first. Amputation WILL stop the pain. The recovery is a week or two... and during that time you hound will be much better off at home with you rather than getting poked and prodded and at the vet.
You are on borrowed time. Don't spend what you have left driving to the vets office.
THIS SITE IS AWESOME!!! I'm reading everything I can on Metronomic (I wasn't aware of this option until the replies on my post) and we have a meeting with our oncologist today. I have new hope and this helps me with the decesion to amputate because other than the limp you wouldn't even know he was sick. We can't throw the tennis ball anymore but still get play time in by him sitting and chasing my hand with his head:)
Thanks again for the support...wow it helps in times like this!!!
Zac
Hi Zac,
I'm so sorry to hear you about Major........I was just about to type a reply to you about metronomic chemo, when I saw your new post. There's tons of info. on here about doggies who did metronomics both before and after finding lung mets....it's not a miracle for ever dog, but it sure has extended the time and quality of life after amputation for some. I'm glad you found that information!
We are here for you now with any questions you may have, if you get a chance, come on over to the chat room ....there's usually a few of us in there in the evenings.
All our love,
Erica & Tripawd Kitty Jill
Jill is a 9-year-old tuxedo kitty. She was diagnosed with Osteosarcoma in June 2012 on her toe in her right hind leg. Her leg was amputated on 12/12/12 and she completed four rounds of chemo (2 of Carbo, 2 of Doxy) in April 2013. "Like" Jill's facebook page: https://www.fac.....tty?ref=hl Proud member of the WINTER WARRIORS!!!! Her blog can be read at http://jillsjou.....ipawds.com. xoxo
Zac, did you see the Blog posts and our various forum posts about metronomic therapy, specifically the ones talking about the 2 major kinds of medications and their side effects. I'd urge you to think more about leukeran (=chlorambucil) rather than cytoxan (=cyclophosphamide).
Where's the bone chip?
~ Katy & Jackson
ACL tear in right hind leg 12/5/12 and scheduled ACL repair surgery 12/21/12. Pre-op xrays revealed osteosarcoma. Amputation 12/28/12. Chemo (carboplatin) started Jan 10, 2013 and ended on April 5, for a total of 5 doses. He handled carbo like a champ! No side effects. We started metronomic therapy at his third chemo and have been also doing some holistic treatments. He's a lively, playful 10 year old huskie-boarder collie and a very proud member of the Winter Warriors! Our love. Our funny little guy!
Bone Chip is in the same leg as his tumor which is located on elbow joint. I'm reading about Leukeran vs. Cytoxan and its seems to be mixed feelings on which to use. Can you tell me why you think Leukeran is better?
Katy has a great post on this, but Leukeran does not come with the dreaded side affect of urinary cystitis that cytoxan does........there are pros and cons to both, but as I said, Katy has a great post.....lemme get the link! hold!
Jill is a 9-year-old tuxedo kitty. She was diagnosed with Osteosarcoma in June 2012 on her toe in her right hind leg. Her leg was amputated on 12/12/12 and she completed four rounds of chemo (2 of Carbo, 2 of Doxy) in April 2013. "Like" Jill's facebook page: https://www.fac.....tty?ref=hl Proud member of the WINTER WARRIORS!!!! Her blog can be read at http://jillsjou.....ipawds.com. xoxo
Great! Frig that leg. It's bum and causing only probs. Once it's gone, Major is going to be Majorly happy and feel like a puppy all over again! Wahoo!
I suggest leukeran b/c it has far less of a chance of causing urinary cystitis. That can also lead to a urinary tract infection. Jackson developed "just" UC, which for him meant he was peeing blood, had A LOT of urgency, strained a lot, was worried/confused about what's happening, and had accidents in the house....for 7 weeks. OK, he "only" had accidents for a week or so, but the other symptoms took forever to clear up. Some pups, once they develop UC, can clear it in a few weeks but I read somewhere on here a dog took 3 months. Given Major's age and senior status in life, I'd hate for him to go through that (& you!). I say, spend a bit more money (it's about twice the cost, maybe a little more, but not 3x) and really keep Major out of the vet hospital for longer.
~ Katy & Jackson
ACL tear in right hind leg 12/5/12 and scheduled ACL repair surgery 12/21/12. Pre-op xrays revealed osteosarcoma. Amputation 12/28/12. Chemo (carboplatin) started Jan 10, 2013 and ended on April 5, for a total of 5 doses. He handled carbo like a champ! No side effects. We started metronomic therapy at his third chemo and have been also doing some holistic treatments. He's a lively, playful 10 year old huskie-boarder collie and a very proud member of the Winter Warriors! Our love. Our funny little guy!
Thanks, Erica. The more people that can benefit from Jackson's unfortunates, the better!
~ K&J
ACL tear in right hind leg 12/5/12 and scheduled ACL repair surgery 12/21/12. Pre-op xrays revealed osteosarcoma. Amputation 12/28/12. Chemo (carboplatin) started Jan 10, 2013 and ended on April 5, for a total of 5 doses. He handled carbo like a champ! No side effects. We started metronomic therapy at his third chemo and have been also doing some holistic treatments. He's a lively, playful 10 year old huskie-boarder collie and a very proud member of the Winter Warriors! Our love. Our funny little guy!
Oh I hear ya Katy, if I could've kept Jill on leukeran, I wouldve, she seems to be the only cat in the world who loses weight on it............
Here you go Zac:
Jill is a 9-year-old tuxedo kitty. She was diagnosed with Osteosarcoma in June 2012 on her toe in her right hind leg. Her leg was amputated on 12/12/12 and she completed four rounds of chemo (2 of Carbo, 2 of Doxy) in April 2013. "Like" Jill's facebook page: https://www.fac.....tty?ref=hl Proud member of the WINTER WARRIORS!!!! Her blog can be read at http://jillsjou.....ipawds.com. xoxo
tjmcbipper said
I am not a fan of holistic medicine for cancer. It simply does not work.
Zac, please keep in mind that this is a personal opinion. We are all entitled to our own opinion, but that's all this is. We are not vets, but we can speak from experience and every dog is different.
Eisen survived osteosarcoma after his amputation for more than five years with only homeopathic treatment. More informatin about Eisen's treatment plan can be found in the Tripawds Nutrition blog .
Dr Demian Dressler recommends a "full-spectrum approach" to treating cancer, encompassing Eastern and Western medicine. And all vets we have interviewed encourage the use of any alternative treatments if they do no harm.
Only you and your veterinary team can determine the best treatment for Major, considering everything from prognosis to finances. Best wishes with the decisions you face.
Tripawds Founders Jim and Rene
tripawds.com | tripawds.org | bemoredog.net | triday.pet
I competely understand these are all personal stories and are not vets. Its just AWESOMEt to be able to "type" to someone that has been there and can relate from their experiance. Before this post all I had to talk with was my wife...who cries 3 times a day and is relying on me to be the strong one!!! I only cry once a day:)
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