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Orrtanna Pa.
Member Since:
25 January 2014
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7 August 2014 - 3:25 pm
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I just wanted to share this. After all we have been through this past year with Ty, I have been avidly reading and researching things I may be able to do to help decrease the risk of cancer. One thing I have read is not so many immunizations. When I had my 11 year old, Chandler in a few weeks ago for his yearly visit, I asked if we could titre him instead of just giving him his shots. We knew his rabies was ok, as it is to last 3 years. Aside from being a bit surprised that I asked about this, my vet was more than willing. The cost, unfortunately was more than the shots would have been,Go figure! His bloodwork came back that he is immune to distemper, Parvovirus and a third one, that I can't think of at the moment. Just wanted to share that. I figured that after 11 years of shots, he had to be immune to something. The only thing he was not willing to titre was Lyme. He said that our area is bad for ticks and the Lyme vaccine does not usually offer much long lasting protection. When his rabies comes due, does anyone know what the rules are for that? Is a good titre good enough or do they really need that little blue tag? Lori and Ty

TY GUY, Best Black Lab ever! Diagnosed  and had amp in January, 2014. Kicked MRSA's butt. Earned his angel wings on April 16, 2014. Run Free my boy and don't forget a shoe. Ty is a proud member of the " April Angels". Ty sent us Daryl, a Tripawd rescue in Sept. of 2016. Daryl is 5 +or -. We are also Pawrents to Chandler, a Border Collie mix who is 15 and 1/2, Lucy, a Corgi who is 7, 2 minis, 2 horses, and a feisty cat named Zoe. Zoe had a non skeletal Osteosarcoma removed in July 2015. No Chemo, she was at least 16. She is going strong although she is now completely blind. She is now close to 20 and her hobbies are eating and sleeping in front of her personal heater. 

Westminster, MD
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31 August 2013
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7 August 2014 - 5:05 pm
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Lori,
I somewhat agree with the vaccines thing........I do believe vaccines are very important early in the pup's or kitty's life, however, after a certain amount of years, I think it is best to back off most of them.

When Polly developed Immune mediated thrombocytopenia after turning 3 years old, we still firmly believe her Lepto vaccine pushed her over the edge. She never had another vaccine again, except for rabies, and that was with steroids on board to help prevent any kind of reaction, in which there was none thankfully. I had done a lot of reading into this thrombocytopenia, and the studies I found had connected IMTP to future cancers, including what Polly got, hemangiosarcoma. I feel like her life was somewhat of a double-edged blade........too many vaccines may cause problems, and the condition she developed quite possibly because of vaccines, may cause future cancers as well. I guess with having to suppress her immune systems with large amounts of steroids to treat the awful IMTP for a pretty long time, is what can cause the cancers to develop, just guessing, though.

Anyway, I have to proceed with caution in the future, regarding vaccines, and how comfortable I am with certain ones......and my vet completely knows my feelings about vaccines since Polly's experiences. Never will over-vaccinate again.....

Love,
Bonnie & Angel Polly





Member Since:
16 October 2012
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7 August 2014 - 6:40 pm
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Funny you should post this.  I have seriously been thinking the past couple of days that maybe I caused Sassy"s cancer by over vaccinations.  Before her cancer she got vaccinations every year except rabies which was every 3 years.. When I switched vets when my orginial vet retired and went to crazy vet lady (long story why I call her that) it was still every year but when we were referred to Dr Boyer we didn't do them for her.   So I was looking at Bosch's records since he was due this year and he got a 3 year vaccination for everything.  Now the girls since they were puppies with their shots only got a one year and when we go back for theirs I assume it will be a 3 year for everything.  I am amazed that this clinic is so proactive that way so they aren't over vaccinating.  Leptospiris they only give to the dogs that are high risk which mine are because of a creek behind our house & lots & lots of wildlife.

 

Everything just runs through your head when Cancer is involved.

 

Hugs, 

Michelle & Angel Sassy

sassymichelle-sm.jpg

Sassy is a proud member of the Winter Warriors. Live long, & strong Winter Warriors.
sassysugarbear.tripawds.com
07/26/2006 - Sassy earned her wings 08/20/2013

05/04/2006 -  Bosch, Sassy's pal, earned his wings 03/29/19  fought cancer for 4 months.

"You aren't doing it TO her, you are doing it FOR her. Give her a chance at life."

Los Angeles, CA
Member Since:
13 June 2013
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7 August 2014 - 7:15 pm
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Another interesting thread and follow-up to my other post - I've always done what the vets wanted and never thought twice about possible vaccinations causing Shelby's cancer. She, like most, got them every year until she got cancer. Then we were done. With Jasper, our normal vet was out so she saw the other vet (who is wicked old, as in should retire old) and he wanted to re-do Jasper's vaccinations in 2 months. Reading this, and reading more, I am not inclined to do that. In fact, I will ask her normal vet about every three years. She had her shots in June before she came to me and due to her rough start, had probably never had them before.

Long story short, I will continue to question the status quo on behalf of Jasper. I can't go through that cancer again... I just can't.

People have also said that Shelby got cancer because we live near LAX and she breathed in those fumes. Using that theory, I should be dead by now since I run by the airport and spend WAY more time outside than she ever did. But environmental is good food for thought. 

~ A

Shelby Lynne; Jack Russell/Shiba Inu mix. Proud member of the April Angels of 2014.

October 15, 2000 to April 8, 2014

Our story: Broke rear leg in June 2013 - non-conclusive results for cancer so leg was plated and pinned. Enlarged spleen in September 2013 and had it removed and was diagnosed with Hemangiosarcoma and started chemotherapy. Became a Tripawd January 8th, 2014 and definitive Hemangiosarcoma diagnosis. Three major surgeries in 7 months and Shelby took them all like a champ only to lose her battle to cancer in her brain. We had 8 amazing extra months together and no regrets. #shelbystrong #loveofmylife

Orrtanna Pa.
Member Since:
25 January 2014
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7 August 2014 - 7:33 pm
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I did not post this to raise any second thoughts for anybody. I also, did the vaccination thing yearly. I never questioned it. Do I truly think that was what caused Ty's cNcer? Probably not. He had other strikes against him...he was a Lab, he had metal implants in that leg for 7 years and his Mom was not a healthy dog. I guess we really never know. I just want to be proactive in the future. I am not sure how I will handle it when I do get a new pup in the future. I know they have to have some to have immunity. Maybe. I am overreacting, I don't know. Lori and Ty

TY GUY, Best Black Lab ever! Diagnosed  and had amp in January, 2014. Kicked MRSA's butt. Earned his angel wings on April 16, 2014. Run Free my boy and don't forget a shoe. Ty is a proud member of the " April Angels". Ty sent us Daryl, a Tripawd rescue in Sept. of 2016. Daryl is 5 +or -. We are also Pawrents to Chandler, a Border Collie mix who is 15 and 1/2, Lucy, a Corgi who is 7, 2 minis, 2 horses, and a feisty cat named Zoe. Zoe had a non skeletal Osteosarcoma removed in July 2015. No Chemo, she was at least 16. She is going strong although she is now completely blind. She is now close to 20 and her hobbies are eating and sleeping in front of her personal heater. 





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7 August 2014 - 7:47 pm
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oh you didn't make me have 2nd thoughts I was already thinking about that.  Nothing you said or did made that come about.  Its part of the whole cancersmancer stuff.  Vaccinations have always been part of that question.  It just made me realize that these vets at our clinic now do a lot of things different than my other vets did.  I know our first vet was a very older farm vet so things were different back then.  Sassy & Bosch had their vaccinations before we went to crazy vet lady.  So i don't know her policy but these its every 3 years for everything.

 

Hugs

Michelle & Angel Sassy

sassymichelle-sm.jpg

Sassy is a proud member of the Winter Warriors. Live long, & strong Winter Warriors.
sassysugarbear.tripawds.com
07/26/2006 - Sassy earned her wings 08/20/2013

05/04/2006 -  Bosch, Sassy's pal, earned his wings 03/29/19  fought cancer for 4 months.

"You aren't doing it TO her, you are doing it FOR her. Give her a chance at life."

Westminster, MD
Member Since:
31 August 2013
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7 August 2014 - 7:54 pm
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Lori,
I don't think you are over-reacting at all......like Michelle said, when cancer is involved, we question EVERYTHING......and I do know many vets that have backed off vaccines when dogs reach a certain age, to try to prevent overload. Even Polly, with her compromised immune system, never got anything she had normally been vaccinated for since stopping vaccines. (But to tell you the truth, I certainly wouldn't have minded her getting, say, corona virus instead of 2 different cancers to fight.) Besides, all this makes for good discussion and debate for all of us, so raising questions and concerns are never bad.

Love,
B & AP

Los Angeles, CA
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13 June 2013
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7 August 2014 - 7:56 pm
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You didn't over-react... Like Michelle said ... when you have cancer... you over think everything. I don't even let Jasper eat carbs (shelby also had a high carb diet so I could also point blame at her dog food). I think, for me, moving forward I am going to be more proactive and more vigilant vs doing what society says ... I do that w/my own diet, I might as well do it for my fur-baby! :-)

Much love!  

Shelby Lynne; Jack Russell/Shiba Inu mix. Proud member of the April Angels of 2014.

October 15, 2000 to April 8, 2014

Our story: Broke rear leg in June 2013 - non-conclusive results for cancer so leg was plated and pinned. Enlarged spleen in September 2013 and had it removed and was diagnosed with Hemangiosarcoma and started chemotherapy. Became a Tripawd January 8th, 2014 and definitive Hemangiosarcoma diagnosis. Three major surgeries in 7 months and Shelby took them all like a champ only to lose her battle to cancer in her brain. We had 8 amazing extra months together and no regrets. #shelbystrong #loveofmylife



Member Since:
27 July 2014
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7 August 2014 - 9:00 pm
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I'm questioning vaccines myself after my cat got a fibrosarcoma from a vaccine injection resulting in a leg amputation. I'm a member of a VAS (vaccine associated sarcoma) bulletin board Dr. Bob, a vet who posts on that site, stated the following about rabies:

"Most States and counties require rabies vaccinations AT 4 MONTHS, ONE YEAR LATER AND THEN EVERY THREE YEARS. Many Vets in these localities falsely tell their clients that every year is better. After the second rabies vaccine, annual rabies vaccines have no effect. Antibodies from the previous rabies vaccine will block the response to subsequent vaccines. (Hogen Esch) “There is no epidemiologic or laboratory evidence to support the annual or bi annual administration of rabies vaccine for dogs.” (Compendium on Rabies, JAVMA) Challenge studies have proven rabies vaccines are good for a least 5 years, probably life ( Aubert). When a client is instructed to get annual rabies vaccines for dogs it is a misrepresentation of the benefit of the vaccine. "The client is paying for something with no effect except the risk of an adverse reaction." ( JAVMA, Aug 15, 1995) "

Regarding lyme disease: "Lyme disease is only found in the 9 New England States & New York , plus Wisconsin , Minnesota and South Dakota . To persuade a client to vaccinate for Lyme in a state with no Lyme disease is a misrepresentation."

If anyone wants to read more from this particular post or info on the VAS bulletin board you can send me a message for the link.

Mona won't be getting any more vaccinations.

Virginia







Member Since:
22 February 2013
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7 August 2014 - 10:10 pm
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MONA AND KAZANN.....Thanks for the information from Dr. BOB! Straight forward, factual, solid.

Great input from everyone
Grateful l y,

Sally and Happy Hannah and Merry Myrtle too!

Happy Hannah had a glorious additional bonus time of over one yr & two months after amp for osteo! She made me laugh everyday! Joined April's Angels after send off meal of steak, ice cream, M&Ms & deer poop!

Los Angeles, CA
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13 June 2013
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8 August 2014 - 11:06 am
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Not to beat a dead horse but I am seriously considering having a conversation with my vet about this after reading all this stuff.

 

However, for Jasper to go to daycare, she needs bordetella every six months. Is that considered one of the vaccinations? 

And my research continues ....

Alison with the Spirit of Shelby fur-ever in her heart (and little Jasper too)

Shelby Lynne; Jack Russell/Shiba Inu mix. Proud member of the April Angels of 2014.

October 15, 2000 to April 8, 2014

Our story: Broke rear leg in June 2013 - non-conclusive results for cancer so leg was plated and pinned. Enlarged spleen in September 2013 and had it removed and was diagnosed with Hemangiosarcoma and started chemotherapy. Became a Tripawd January 8th, 2014 and definitive Hemangiosarcoma diagnosis. Three major surgeries in 7 months and Shelby took them all like a champ only to lose her battle to cancer in her brain. We had 8 amazing extra months together and no regrets. #shelbystrong #loveofmylife

Martinsburg, WV
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3 June 2014
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8 August 2014 - 12:25 pm
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This is another topic I've looked into A LOT since Leland's passing (along with the early neuter/spay studies).  I came across an article by Catherine O'Driscoll titled "Dog Vaccine Side Effects - Are We Vaccinating Dogs too Much?"  Ms. O'Driscoll sites various studies and what has been discovered.  She points out that continued vaccines can be linked to conjunctivitis, gastro-intestinal issues, issues within the immune and endocrine systems, behavioral issues, encephalitis/epilepsy, and tumors at the injection site.  She had also written a book (which I have recently ordered off Amazon) called "What Vets Don't Tell You About Vaccines".

In her article she wrote "the Merck Manual offers some words of caution.  It is produced by a giant vaccine manufacturer called Merck, and it's the doctor's bible.  Under childhood immunization, Merck states that patients with B and/or T cell immunodeficiency, or from families with B and/or T cell immunodeficiency, should not receive live virus vaccines due to the risk of fatality.  Merck describes features of B and T cell immunodeficiency as inhalant allergies, food allergies, eczema, dermatitis, neurological deterioration and heart disease.  Does this describe your dog?  Children under the care of good doctors and nurses ask parents whether any of the above conditions exist in a family and, if they do, they refrain from administering live virus vaccines (which is what we give to our dogs).  So you can't get away from one fact: you could kill your dog (who also has B and T cells) if your dog or his line suffers from any of the above conditions, and you inject live virus vaccines into him.  Logically, it makes sense to repeat the vaccine risk as infrequently as you possibly can."

Also, the breeder that we got Lucian from is adamant that he does not need any further vaccines (except for the rabies) than what they have given the pups.  To do so would void the lifetime warranty that they provide on the animal.  She told us that over-vaccination destroys the dog's immune system as well as causing problems with the thyroid (which at the end we found out Leland was dealing with both).

There's a lot of articles out there about this topic so I encourage people to do a little research before just following along blindly with what vets are telling us (articles mention that yearly vaccines is money coming into the practice).  My husband and I trusted in what vets were telling us with regards to Leland and in my opinion he ultimately paid the price for my lack of knowledge.  I will not make this mistake again with Lucian and if I tick off vets from here on out with my questions of their procedures and what they're doing so be it.  

With regards to the original question of titre testing I have seen articles mention this as an alternative to yearly vaccines to make sure our dogs still have immunity to the diseases.  If I'm not mistaken I think I've read where there a 2 companies making titre testing kits that vets can order in so it can be done in the office instead of sending the blood sample out to a lab.

As for me and Lucian, he will not be getting yearly vaccines and I will request a titre test to be done. 

Sahana and her Angel Leland

Leland

November 17, 2009 - June 30, 2014

May you finally be healthy and running free at the Rainbow Bridge. Until we meet again my sweet boy!

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1 August 2014
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8 August 2014 - 7:48 pm
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I had a black lab that died way too young. She became ill inexplicably and quickly after a routine vwt trip and her annual shots. Her cell counts were always messed up, and she lost weight rapidly. We never undestood what happened, but our vet told us after we expressed fear of vaccinatiom that we didnt need to have them done. My mom told her the city required rabies for city tag; however our vet assured us she could write a letter and have our dogs excused from rabies. For whatever rwason we didnt go along with it, I think we convinced ourselves something else had hapoened to our sweet Chevy. After reading experiences on thid forum, I'm convinced agaim that the shots gave her something, possibly camcer due to her white cells beimg messed up.

My husky is now 14. She's due for her distemper. I'm not gettimg it. I'm not paying for any more shots when she's had them all her life. Im not convimced it's a good thing anymore, and honestly I sometimes feel like it's a ploy to get more money. In fact, if she's still around when her rabies is due again in 3 years, I'm asking for a letter.

as for my cat, I'm contemplating only getting necessary shots too. I don't know yet. It's hard to tell because she's young. I don't know if I'd vaccinate after 2 years or so. I jyst don't know. The world of animal medicine is definitely changing.

Tina and Smore

(with the spirit of Pebbles watching from the Rainbow Bridge)

 

Smore is my tripawd kitty who adopted me one summer evening. She had an injury to her front left leg and had to have her leg removed July 17th. She was only 3 or 4 months old at the time. Now she moves faster than some four legged cats!

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31 October 2014
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31 October 2014 - 6:50 pm
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Gday All,

My GSD pup AJ, had her first immunisation a C3, but had been told a lot of dogs develop allergies and other health problems from them. Some contain mercury as stabilisers. We've now changed her over to a homepathic immunisation called an oral nosode. Apparently they can do blood tests to prove immunity against diseases like regular vaccines. They can also be approved by some kennels etc, as a valid form of vaccination.

GSD's in Australia can be prone to allergies, but 10 month old AJ, has no allergies and is is perfectly healthy. Might also have something to do with her BARF diet too.

anyway my 2 cents worth.

regards

Brenden and AJ

On The Road


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1 November 2014 - 11:28 pm
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Thanks for sharing your experience Brenden, it's good to know how the titres issue is being addressed in Austalia. I've found it very difficult to find kennels in the U.S. who are willing to take titres for a dog who doesn't have an ongoing issue like cancer. That's awesome you can find ones who will work with you on that.

And yeah I'm sure the BARF diet has a lot to do with her health too. Feel free to share more about that in our "Eating Healthy" Discussion Forum, I know lots of folks would find it useful.

Tripawds Founders Jim and Rene
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