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1 Yr Amp Anniversary-Struggling with Arthritis
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Forum Posts: 23
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15 February 2021 - 6:19 pm
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Hi, our 100lb rottie has hit the 1 yr mark and as of his last visit he had not shown any signs of osteosarcoma spread. 

He is 10+ yrs and 100lbs. He has never been strong post amp surgery. We did not do rehab as it is a drive and too hard getting him in and out of the car.

About 2 months ago we noticed his back was really crooked and his legs were wobbly. We took him to the surgeon for an assesment and also had a chiro adjust him. All was as well to be expected. The surgeon upped his gabapentin and added in Amantadine 1x a day. He is also on Rimadyl and all of the supplements, Dasaquin, wellactin, k9 immunity etc. 

We started him on Adequan 3 weeks ago, tried CBD which did not agree with his system am now introducing golden paste. Also 3 weeks ago he had a dose of Bravecto, which I now think had contributed to a few mild seizures over the last year. He also had another chiropractic adjustment which we saw no results. 

All of that being said, not sure if Adequan is working but will stick with it. He is in more pain and balancing on front leg and one of his back legs. The other back leg is quite stiff. He also dribbling pee and leaking sometimes in his sleep. I have also found a few poop nuggets when he is sleeping. Again, this all happened in the last month so not it doesn't sound like arthritis has just kicked in that quickly. 

We are dealing with 3 vets, reg vet, surgeon and oncologist and due to his size I can't bounce him back and forth to appts. They don't talk to each other so I feel I am spinning trying to figure this out. I think he needs pain management for his hips.

Any suggestions on next steps? Do cortisone shots work for pain? How long does it take to see effects of Adequan? I think golden paste will help if his system can tolerate it. I think the Bravecto may have caused some nerve issues. I am trying him on low dose of milk thistle for liver support to detox him from Bravecto. I know prolozone shots work well in humans for arthritis but can't find a local vet here that does the shots. 

I am at a loss on what steps to take next to help him manage his pain.

Thank you in advance!

*Update. I just spoke with the surgeon and we are dropping his dose of Gabapentin. Oncologist had our rottie on 100mg 2x a day. When we visited surgeon for arthritis he upped to dose of Gabapentin to 200mg 2x a day. I read the side effects and it can make you wobbly and drowsy and our guy is definitely sensitive to meds.  I know this is not a complete fix but hopefully backing him off of the higher dose will help him get some stability back. 

Virginia




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15 February 2021 - 8:50 pm
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Well first of all,l HAPPY ONE YEAR AMPUVERSARY!!!  This is a great milestone to celebrate!  Hope your boy gets cake and steak!

You ce6rtainly are doing everything possible for your boy,  that's for sure.  

I'm not fam with Bravecto and side effects, so others will have to chime in.  Don't  know about the prolozone either.

I can certainly understand  your frustration  in dealing  with different Vets and no one giving you guidance and solutions.  What do these   Vets say about what's  going on with him as far as the seizures, poop while sleeping and the arched back??

What assessment by the Vet has been done to verify that his back and leg issues are arthritis?  Have cruciate knee issues been eliminated?  Any possible disc or spine issues of some sort?

Is the Adequan twice a week for first couple of weeks, then once a week, then every other, etc.  I m ow some peo feel like Adequan works for them, some don't.  If he's had two  ejections s twice a wee, for two or three weeks now, you probably  should see some improvement.  Keep in mind though, every dog is different  and reacts to meds differently. 

 Steroids/cortisone  shots do help with inflammation. but your Bets need to advise.

Do the supplements and pain meds  seem to help?   Try massaging  up mand down his spi e, his neck and shoulder area.  Any sign of tension?

And that's a pretty low dose of Gaba for a big boy, so it shouldn't  cause .lethargy.  then again, if he's very med sensitive,  maybe it could.

I really wish uoj could get jist one consult  with a Rehab Specialist.   They are quite skilled at identifying causes and solutions. 

I know I'm asking  more quest than giving  answers.  Jist throwing  a ythi g I can think of out there. Hopefully others can be a bit more beneficial. 

Hang in there.  You're doing a good job of figuring  things out and advocating  for youir boy

Oh, maybe you could show us a video of him walking .  Besides, we'd .ove to see your boy anyway!

Hugs

Sally and Alumni Happy Hannah and Merry Myrtle and Frankie too!.

Happy Hannah had a glorious additional bonus time of over one yr & two months after amp for osteo! She made me laugh everyday! Joined April's Angels after send off meal of steak, ice cream, M&Ms & deer poop!

The Rainbow Bridge



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15 February 2021 - 10:20 pm
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That's awesome that the cancer is behaving itself, and a big hoppy ampuversary to your pup. I apologize but I am having a brain fart, what is his name?  Give him a smooch from us! sf-kiss

It really sounds like his pain management needs a more coordinated effort from a pain specialist. The symptoms you are describing sound like some kind of pain issues. The poop accidents could also be from losing enough strength to contain his bowels (this happened to our Wyatt, a rear leg amputee). Many older dogs have poop accidents though so it could just be an old dog thing. But rather than just take a stab and guess, it would be helpful to find a pain specialist.

Resolving pain issues takes a multi-pronged approach and not all vets are up on the latest treatments. Chiropractic can be helpful but that alone usually doesn't solve a dog's arthritis issues. Golden paste doesn't have enough hard evidence that proves it's effective, my guess is that your money would be better spent elsewhere if you are able to afford the treatments. I see that Trupanion covered his amputation, so if you have the rehab rider on his policy they will cover that too.

Sounds like you and your current vet are on the right track with the Adequan and the medications though (although I agree with Sally that's a super low dose for him; to compare, our dog Wyatt was 75 pounds and he was on 400 mg 3x daily for arthritis, along with Amantadine and a muscle relaxer).

As hard as it is to get your big guy to a rehab center, it sounds like now is as good a time as any to give it a try, or look for a therapist who can come to you. If you want to message me your location I'm happy to do a search for you.

Here is a blog post we wrote about managing Wyatt's arthritis pain:

https://tripawd.....rednisone/

It's better to hop on three legs than to limp on four.™
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16 February 2021 - 4:51 pm
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Thank you both for your kind words and feedback. We see his oncologist in 3 weeks and she is great with the med cocktail. For now, we are reducing the gabapentin. He was on 400mg post surgery and once he went down to 100mg 2x a day he got his personality back. He has a sensitive stomach and system and cannot tolerate a lot of meds. 
I have started on the golden paste, which I make myself so very low cost and will continue with Adequan. We just did shot #3 last week. He is currently getting 1 shot/week. Surgeon said to keep it up for the next few weeks to see if we have any improvement. 
I tried cbd for a second time in his life and bis system does not like it at all! I am also trying Myos Canine Formula which seems to have great reviews when dealing with muscle loss. 
Thank you for the recommendation for prednisone . I will ask oncologist about this as well. 

The Rainbow Bridge



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16 February 2021 - 6:08 pm
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Oh the Myos Canine Formula is supposed to be GREAT! Please let us know how it works OK? Keep us posted!

It's better to hop on three legs than to limp on four.™
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17 February 2021 - 3:49 pm
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Hi there! Decreasing the Gabapentin did not work so we are going to work to up the dosage. We will go back up to 200mg 2x a day and then up it again if we don't get results. Luckily I have 400mg tabs from his previous surgery. 

We will see how the next few days go. If we see improvement I will ask about Amantadine 2x a day and go from there. 

Should we see results from increasing Gabapentin pretty quickly or does it take time to build in his system?

Thank you again! G.O.B. is doing his best to hang in there. ❤️

Virginia




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17 February 2021 - 5:46 pm
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200 mg twice a day is not a lot for 100 lb Eottie.  And yes, pain meds do need to be given consistently  with as little up and down adjustment as possible  to give the right dose time to work.

I know you are dealing with stomach issues aim it's hard to find the right dose if more helps, but hurts his tummy.

What assessment  has been done to verify this is arthritis?  I guess a better question would be what assessments have they done to eliminate anything else, i,e disc issues?

I guess another question would be why not go ahead and add the amantadine wiith the Gaba?  Again, "generally" this would be considered  a fairly low dosage of the two for a dog with no tummy issues or overly sensitive  to meds.

Guessing they're  done bloodwork to ensure no kidney issues, etc?

Oh, she's only had three Adequan  thre ijections over three weeks, so it may need more ti e to show benefits.

Obviously,  not a Vet and not giving  Vet advice..    just thinking  maybe better pain management   may be helpful.  Other tha. The outward signs of stiffness and wobbling. does he show pain signals like painting, whining, restlessness  and inability  to get comfortavle?

As usual, throwing  out more questions than answers!!  Vut somrwhere in there we can fi d so e solutions  for your sweet Eottie♥️. Hang in there!!

Hugs

Sally and Alumni Happy Hannah and Merry Myrtle and Frankie too!

Happy Hannah had a glorious additional bonus time of over one yr & two months after amp for osteo! She made me laugh everyday! Joined April's Angels after send off meal of steak, ice cream, M&Ms & deer poop!

The Rainbow Bridge



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17 February 2021 - 7:20 pm
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Sorry he's still having pain. Are you working with the oncologist on those medication dosages? I'm with Sally, 200mg is still really low for a dog his size so I'm not positive if you would ever see better results with that dosage. The right dose of Gabapentin would likely be apparent within 24 hours (that's my non-vet best guess). And yep, Amantadine can work really well with Gabapentin. Our Wyatt was on the combo.

It's better to hop on three legs than to limp on four.™
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18 February 2021 - 10:50 am
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Hi Jerry,

Unfortunately G.O.B. is getting worse and not getting up. We noticed the last time we brought him out to eat, pee, and poop, he no longer wanted to move. He went right back to bed. 
His body is tired and we made the decision to have him euthanized today. He is losing control of his bowels this am and has no fight to get up to pee or poop. We evaluated everything and know he is telling us it is time. 
We are thankful for the year we had post amp and knowing we kept him healthy and cancer free for that year. He is a big guy and hopping around on three legs has always been difficult due to his build. 
We are so thankful for this group and all of the support we have received. We could not have gotten through this without you. 

The Rainbow Bridge



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18 February 2021 - 11:14 am
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Oh wow my heart aches for you, I'm really sorry. Making that decision is so difficult, but in our hearts when we know it's the right thing to do, there is a bit of comfort in knowing we were there when our beloved dog needed us most.

Please know that we are keeping you in our hearts and lighting a candle for your sweet boy. If you'd like to talk, we are here for you. 

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It's better to hop on three legs than to limp on four.™
Latest Tripawds News
Read my story here.

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Virginia




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18 February 2021 - 12:07 pm
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The gift of release is the most selfless act of love we can give our pups.

Clear.y he has let you k ow he is needs to shed the earth clothes  that he no lo ger needs.  He needs to run freeto the Rainbow Bridge   where he can be young and whole agan.

You can take comfort  in knowing  he was soooo well .oved and sooo beautifully  cared for and enjoyed  every mome t with you.  I k ow he was glad for the exte ded time to gave him a year ago so he could enjoy more loving and spoiling and tummy rub

Please , please know, we are here for you and are sending  love and strength  and peace.  We u derstand the depth of grief and  loss when freeing g our Tripawds when it's their time.  And he has shown you very clearly it's his time to transition.   We cry with yoj today

We also celebrate  a life so well loved and so well lived.  He clearly was adored..and he adored you too♥️

When you can, p,ease share more of the ,adventures utes you had with your boy

Surrounding you with our love.and with all the Happy memories of your special boy.

Sally and Alumni Happy Hannah and Merry Myrtle and Frankie 

Happy Hannah had a glorious additional bonus time of over one yr & two months after amp for osteo! She made me laugh everyday! Joined April's Angels after send off meal of steak, ice cream, M&Ms & deer poop!

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