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Happy Hannah two wks. on Cytoxan and UTI already?? Is that even possible?
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Virginia




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6 August 2013 - 11:48 am
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As ALWAYS, thabk you for taking time to help us yet again.

Took Happy Hannah in for first two week blood test. Don't even recall Onco sayi g to get a urinalysis too, but my Vet said let's go on and do o e.

Blood work won't be back til roorrow.

Uri e samp.e showed 0 to 3 red blood cells in field.

Small amt. of bacteria but ne felt it was not u expected in a dog her size....said she has a big vulva!! Guess that's the equivalent of a boy dog having "big pee pee"!:-) Be proud Hannah! Be proud!

So is it even possible to nappen this quicky? Is it possible that she's had this for awhile and I just didn't know it? You'll see below, she may have been having peeing accidents in house, but I thought it was my other pup with kidneys fading.

Gave me a prescription for Cephalexin but said to hold off til blood work came back for whole picture.

Otherwise, she's absolutely vibrant, joyful, happy and, of course, eating like a hippo! Very surprised and disappointed (with myself) that she's actually gained a couple of pounds!! And that's on a diet!

Now, the only other thing is, there have been some accidents in tne house BUT, I've attributed them to my almost sixteen yr. old Bodie who does have renal kidney stuff going on. It could be both of them.....so I can't say for sure that Happy Hannah is sympton free!

Anyway, haven't spoken to Onco het, but needless to say she's off Cytoxan and will probably start her antibiodic tomorrow. I'll also put her on cranberry pills? Yes? And Mylatin to help with phosphorus binding??

This should clear up right away, right? Couldn't be anything else, right?

Thanks for any and all nput my friends! You're the gift that keeps on giving:-)

Lots of love, Sall and Happy Hannah

Happy Hannah had a glorious additional bonus time of over one yr & two months after amp for osteo! She made me laugh everyday! Joined April's Angels after send off meal of steak, ice cream, M&Ms & deer poop!



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6 August 2013 - 12:36 pm
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Is it possible she had an UTI before starting the cytoxin?  Not saying its not possible that fast.  Sassy's vet said normal 0-3 red cells is pretty normal not to much to be worried about.  But you are doing the right thing.  Get her cleared up.  Also see about the leukeran.  Sassy is 130 pounds 6mg of the leukeran and that runs us 86.70 (includes the 6.75 for shipping)  but Apex informed me it would be cheaper to do a 3 month supply 189.95 plus then shipping.  which is 2.11/per pill.  which monthly its 2.96 per pill.  A little cheaper to do the 3 month supply.

 

Ok Hannah, do your part get better girl. 

 

Hugs

Michelle & Sassy   

sassymichelle-sm.jpg

Sassy is a proud member of the Winter Warriors. Live long, & strong Winter Warriors.
sassysugarbear.tripawds.com
07/26/2006 - Sassy earned her wings 08/20/2013

05/04/2006 -  Bosch, Sassy's pal, earned his wings 03/29/19  fought cancer for 4 months.

"You aren't doing it TO her, you are doing it FOR her. Give her a chance at life."

Virginia




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6 August 2013 - 12:57 pm
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A huge thank you Michelle for your quick and always i formative response!

Yeah, I've been mulling it over and over in my head (okay, obsessing) and thinking she must have had it before! Kicking myself just a touch thinking that all the peeing that's been going on BEFORE she started Cytoxin was from Bodie....now I'm thiking combo.

Guess we can start a Luekeran club around nere. Thanks for the pricing and doseage info. too! You help in soooooo many ways!

Mucho lovo to you and Sassy:-)

Sally and Hapy Hannah

Happy Hannah had a glorious additional bonus time of over one yr & two months after amp for osteo! She made me laugh everyday! Joined April's Angels after send off meal of steak, ice cream, M&Ms & deer poop!

Virginia




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6 August 2013 - 1:10 pm
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Ohhhhh dear, idiotitis takes over again! Did NOT mean to put this under "Hopping Around"... but rather "Ask A Vet"

I bet if "you kno who" sees this, she'll plop it in the right spot and make me look like I knew what I was doing all slong:-) What would we do without "you k ow who"?

HEY! Might as well use this to promote Happy Hannah's new You Tube video under "Anything Goes":-) :-) Looking mighty healthy to me!! Be sure and watch her eyebrows! And a whole lot of thanks to the other "you know who" for helping:-)

Happy Hannah had a glorious additional bonus time of over one yr & two months after amp for osteo! She made me laugh everyday! Joined April's Angels after send off meal of steak, ice cream, M&Ms & deer poop!

krun15
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6 August 2013 - 5:23 pm
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Topic moved by the junior 'you know who' big-grin

 

 

Tolland, CT
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6 August 2013 - 6:23 pm
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Hey Sally; just added to Roxie's lung met post; she's giving me fits, too.  Can't imagine she and Hannah could possibly think they're not already getting enough attention!!!  I have a similar mystery-pee-er in my house; still don't know if it's Roxie's geriatric kidneys or Smokey's puppy-brain bladder, but the pee pads are out every night by the door and there's a disgusted cat sitting next to a wet one every 7-10 days.  No clue...maybe both.  At least "someone" is going there rather than any other unauthorized spot.  Hey, with your sharp computer skills why don't you set up a web cam?

Hope the blood work gets her to an easy solution.

 

-Liz & Roo

 


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6 August 2013 - 7:27 pm
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I am not sure if I would stop the Cytoxan based on that sample alone.  Sterile hemorrhagic cystitis would show a large amount of blood (0 to 5 cells is normal).  It sounds like the urine sample was a free catch so any bacteria there could be normal since it had to pass through her vaginal tissue.  A cystocentesis is a sterile sample with a needle (a lot easier than it sounds) direct from the bladder.  This urine can then be cultured to rule out infection.  If a urine culture was not done prior to starting Cytoxan then it might have been present before the drug was started.

If you still want to go with Leukeran because it is safer that is okay too but it may not be as potent against the cancer.  My dog Tazzie was prone to UTIs and I did eventually culture Pseudomonas from her bladder (a very bad bug) so I did stop the Cytoxan since it took 6 weeks of antibiotics to clear that up.  I think you are smart to start the cranberry!

Pam

Virginia




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6 August 2013 - 8:10 pm
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Thanks soooo much Pam! No, nothing was done before the Cytoxan other than blood work and xrays

I just have a "gut" feeling ..and based on what you and Michelle said about the normal range....that she doesn't have a uti. There will be a couple of days delay on getting ner back on Cytoxan anyway as Onco onlh gave me prescrp. for two weeks.....which, f course she inished Sat. and couldn't get vet check til todah and onco phone app. til toorrow! Then t will take two days for shipping Soooo she'll be off five or six days anyway....ugh....or yay...depending, huh?

Will the blood work clarify if it's anything. Seems likeif the sample is in the ormal range then I would't even vother with the needle bladder thing, right?

One more thing, do most oco. do the bladder culture before Cytoxan? Needless t say, mine didn't. What would we do without our Pam?? You have to stay here withus forever, okay??:-) :-)

Hey "JUNIOR".....Thanks for putting this in the right spot:-) :-) You're invaluable too!

Liz and Roo! Thanks for posting even though you have so much going on K,m pretty sure it's the senior peeing (that would be Bodi) a d, if anything, Hannah's sneaking over peeing withthe attitude, "if he can peein the huse, so can I". Whoever's doing it, they at least get up and do kt on the pee pad! think I'm being played over here! I'm the o ly o e going outside like a "good girl"!.....kiddng!

Happy Hannah had a glorious additional bonus time of over one yr & two months after amp for osteo! She made me laugh everyday! Joined April's Angels after send off meal of steak, ice cream, M&Ms & deer poop!


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7 August 2013 - 2:36 pm
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I am not sure if most oncologists culture prior but I did with my dog since she was so prone to UTI so that way I knew it was the Cytoxan that caused it.  I would leave that up to your onc but I  usually at least check a cysto urine 3 months into the treatment then at least every 6 months. 

Pam

Virginia




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7 August 2013 - 10:53 pm
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Pam, what would it take to have you move to Virginia and be Happy Hannah's Physician/Onco.? There is a HUGE need for some on of your knowledge here!

As usual, I didn't speak with onco but tech called me back and o co will be go e now til Mom.
Okay, if you'll just bear with me.....

The specific questions K left for the onco were these

Based on the free catch urinalysis with a 0 to 3 field and great blood work-up, can I star her o Cephalexan AND cotinue with the Cytoxan for another two weeks?
Also, do I continue with the Piroxicam regardless? With, or without either drug? If I do Luk., still do Piricam?

Or, can I switch to Luekeran with the antibiodic.

Is the cephalexin given REGARDLESEs of uti caused by Cytoxan or by bacteria

ALSO' my vet wasn't "co fortable doing the bladder needle thing on such a bid dog. Could you explain to tme the dangers, the accuracy, etc.
In the meantime, regardless of which chemo I go with, do I keep her on antibiodic?

Sooooo all those questio s left for the onco, culminated in ths:
This was the answer from vet tech.....

Stop Cytoxan........start Lukeran if I want to but will only do a week's supply as she would want more test then p,us xrays There are no studies o Luk. and more expensive and blah blah

OR Come in for that vladder needle thing and o from there

Sooooo my dear Pam......
She's been off carboplatin almost three months and on cytaxonn just two weeks It would be next week before I can do the needle thing So she's be off cytoxan over a week.

I knw I'm asking a lot of you but guess I'm still unclear AND I'm afraid of what cou go wrong with that needle thing? Of course, the answers K got had very little to do with the questions!

Your generosity and willingness to nelp us is so very appreciated!!

With so much gratitide, Hapy Hannah and I thank you!
I'm just not getting if this urunalysis thingis in the normal range and blood workmis all good whh have to take her off Cytoxan and d the needle thing before she'll give me a prescription

And, she only was given four carboplating as thismonco said a fidth wasn't necessary.. and she went to Cornell and four is all they did at Cornell!!

Happy Hannah had a glorious additional bonus time of over one yr & two months after amp for osteo! She made me laugh everyday! Joined April's Angels after send off meal of steak, ice cream, M&Ms & deer poop!

The Rainbow Bridge



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8 August 2013 - 7:10 am
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Hannah, I'm no vet so I can't really help you decide what to do but I just want to give you some {{{{{{{hugs}}}}}

It's better to hop on three legs than to limp on four.™
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Virginia




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8 August 2013 - 8:59 am
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Thanks Jerry! Just now grabbed your hugs and shared 'em with Happy Hannah! They divided up exactly equally too! Did you plan it that way?

Thanks...and perfect timing.:-)

Lotta' love back to you!

Sally and hug loving Happy Hannah

Happy Hannah had a glorious additional bonus time of over one yr & two months after amp for osteo! She made me laugh everyday! Joined April's Angels after send off meal of steak, ice cream, M&Ms & deer poop!



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8 August 2013 - 10:27 am
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Sally,

I understand all the confusion.  All I can say is they did a bladder tap on Sassy & she is as big as Hannah.  Well 130  pounds of her.  She did fine with it.  Possibly doing another one Saturday just to make sure that the results we got yesterday is actually caused from the Cytoxin because there was a trace amount of bacteria and that is the easiest way to do a sterile urine test.

 

Sorry that is all the info I have :)

 

Hugs

Michelle & Sassy

sassymichelle-sm.jpg

Sassy is a proud member of the Winter Warriors. Live long, & strong Winter Warriors.
sassysugarbear.tripawds.com
07/26/2006 - Sassy earned her wings 08/20/2013

05/04/2006 -  Bosch, Sassy's pal, earned his wings 03/29/19  fought cancer for 4 months.

"You aren't doing it TO her, you are doing it FOR her. Give her a chance at life."

Virginia




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8 August 2013 - 11:37 am
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No, Michelle, that was VERY informative and helpful? I feel reassured about the test from a "big dog's" perspective.

Let me ask you this....if the bladder tap shows caused by Cytoxin, of course they stop it....and do they STILL take the cephalexn or which ever antiviodic prescribed? Hannah's off it already because onco won't do another prescripyion......you saw the comments above avout Luekeran........"if" "I" want to,,etc.

If the bladder tap comes back okay, then they can co tinue the Cytoxin, right? Do they STILL take the antibiodic because the "free catch" showed bacteria?

If it's the "free catch" UTI, then ....okay....if I can phrase this right...-.--.she CAN take Cytoxan because the Cytoxan did not cause that?

Head spinning over here!!!

And may I present Dr. Michelle, DVM!! I computer crashing......million thanks.....really do mean it

Happy Hannah had a glorious additional bonus time of over one yr & two months after amp for osteo! She made me laugh everyday! Joined April's Angels after send off meal of steak, ice cream, M&Ms & deer poop!



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8 August 2013 - 2:18 pm
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Well, our vet didn't put Sassy on antibiotics this time because if its not a true UTI they won't help.  The problem we are having now is because so much is in her system that it can take 6 weeks plus to work its way out.  We have the option of a drug for bladder spasms but not sure yet if we are doing this.  Dr Boyer doesn't want to throw too many drugs at her.  So we are going to probably redo the tap on Saturday to determine if actual UTI or if its from Cytoxin which we are leaning more towards the reaction to the Cytoxin.  The results from last tap & culture were negative so we knew it was from Cytoxin.  That is why we changed to the Leukeran.  Which I was nervous about because of Sassy doing so well on the Cytoxin.

 

Right "Free Catch".  I would probably do the bladder tap just to make sure though Sally.

 

No way am I a vet always wanted to be one but not smart enough :)

 

Hugs

Michelle & Sassy

 

 

 

 

sassymichelle-sm.jpg

Sassy is a proud member of the Winter Warriors. Live long, & strong Winter Warriors.
sassysugarbear.tripawds.com
07/26/2006 - Sassy earned her wings 08/20/2013

05/04/2006 -  Bosch, Sassy's pal, earned his wings 03/29/19  fought cancer for 4 months.

"You aren't doing it TO her, you are doing it FOR her. Give her a chance at life."

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