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Caring for a Three Legged Dog or Cat

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Recurring soft-tissue sarcoma in 14 yo cat - vet says to amputate
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The Rainbow Bridge



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1 September 2023 - 8:44 pm
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Seems like it always comes back more aggressively than before. At least that's what we see here with quite a few members.

If this is any help at all ... in my other life I write for a human amputee magazine called Amplitude. I've interviewed several people who had "elective' amputation because their damaged limb was just too painful to live with on a daily basis. They did everything they could to save it. But once the limb was gone, of course they mourned and had recovery issues, but in the end they felt a sense of freedom from that pain that opened up a lot of doors in their life. I imagine that if our animals spoke our language, they would tell us the same thing.

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5 September 2023 - 1:14 pm
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So we got a call from the oncologist's office this afternoon... they are currently booking six weeks out.  So the earliest appointment was October 19th.  And they wanted $100 to schedule the appointment, which would go towards the cost of the appointment.  So I talked with my husband and he wants to see if there is anywhere else we can get referred to, so he called the vet back and left them a message.  Good thing that things with Tara aren't super urgent right now, but still.  Husband was not optimistic about how much the appointment would cost if it was $100 just to get in the door.

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The Rainbow Bridge



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5 September 2023 - 8:04 pm
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Yikes that's a long wait. I'm sorry! If you want to PM me your location I can try researching other facilities for you in the meantime.

Many clinics are charging appointment deposits these days, even for primary care visits. $100 would be about the going rate for specialty care. 

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11 September 2023 - 10:28 am
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Hi all - Kind of a non-update update, but oh well.  The vet was going to refer us to both NC State as well as the chain of emergency vet hospitals we have around here (who knew they have oncologists?) called Blue Pearl.  Originally they referred us to the Triangle Veterinary Referral Hospital, but their appointments were 6 weeks out.  So NC State was booking appointments 8 weeks out, so the vet didn't even bother putting in a referral.  She said she did do the referral to Blue Pearl.  So hopefully they will call me at some point and I can schedule an appointment.  I get the feeling that we are kind of just doing this to say we got a second opinion and did everything possible before we did amputation.  So it could be that after we talk to the Blue Pearl people, if they also say amputate I think we will probably go back to our family vet and have them do it.  The guy who removed the tumor twice before is an orthopedic surgeon, so I'd rather have him do it.  Of course, I still want to schedule a pre-op appointment with him so I can ask all the questions like if you keep her overnight, will someone be here? etc.  

Before Blue Pearl became Blue Pearl, the chain was something like VCA but I don't remember what the letters stood for - anyway, they saved another one of our cats, Jake, who had eaten the tie from a sleeping bag (almost identical to a shoelace) out of stress about 2 weeks after we adopted him.  We took him in and they x-rayed him and it was all still in his stomach, so we then went to their other location which had better facilities and they pulled it out through his throat and didn't have to cut him open.  It was $$$ and Jake became my most expensive cat even though we had only had him for about two weeks at that point.  But those people were awesome and if it was still owned by them I wouldn't hesitate to trust them with the surgery.  But we have only been back once since it became Blue Pearl and that was for one of our dogs who had her eye sort of halfway pop out of its socket during some roughhousing with the neighbor's dog, and husband was not thrilled with them at all (though it was in fall of 2020, so things were weird due to the pandemic and that might just have caused some of the awkwardness of the whole thing).  They did just fine and took care of Bella and she came out of it with zero damage which was pretty amazing, but again husband wasn't thrilled with the way it was handled, largely due to COVID.

Tara is still in her cone.  I want to figure out what we are going to do and do it, all this waiting isn't doing anyone any good.

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The Rainbow Bridge



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11 September 2023 - 11:08 am
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Thanks for the update on Tara, it does sound like you are doing all you can do to move forward. 

Vet care during the pandemic pretty much imploded as much as they all tried so hard to be there for pet parents. Our Wyatt Ray needed emergency dental surgery at the height of it in April 2020 so I get what you mean. Things have gotten much better since then, but like every industry there are staffing shortages that sometimes impact delivery of care. A batch of cookies for the team goes a long way to keep morale high and help our pets get that extra love 🙂

Hang in there!

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12 September 2023 - 9:57 am
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So I wrote a reply, but then somehow it was eaten.  Anyway, the oncologist called and we have an appointment on Wednesday the 27th for Tara at Blue Pearl, but at the location that is further away from us (actually the place that saved Jake when he ate the shoelace, though it was under different management then) because apparently that is where their surgery/radiation equipment/etc. is located.  I am not crazy about the practice because they are primarily an emergency vet, but I looked up the guy we are seeing and he got his DVM from Cornell which is pretty good (to my understanding).  He also did an oncology residency at Tufts.  So I guess we'll see what he says in about two weeks!  Tara is pretty stable and hopefully she will stay that way for now.

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The Rainbow Bridge



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12 September 2023 - 10:59 am
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Good! The 27th is closer, and it will be helpful to talk with them. If that's Dr. Ruslander you're talking about, he's got some great credentials as a double-boarded oncologist! 

Glad Tara is doing well. Keep us posted.

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Virginia



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12 September 2023 - 2:09 pm
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Okay, the appt is set and that jas ro be a relief (to some degree anyway)

Glad Tara is holding steady. Give her a smooch for us🥰🥰

Hugs

Sally and Alumni Happy Hannah and Merry Myrtle and Frankie too!

Happy Hannah had a glorious additional bonus time of over one yr & two months after amp for osteo! She made me laugh everyday! Joined April's Angels after send off meal of steak, ice cream, M&Ms & deer poop!

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12 September 2023 - 4:07 pm
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Yes, it's Dr. Ruslander.  I looked him up online and I guess he's been at this same practice for almost 20 years!  That means his DVM is from the 80's, but he also had a couple of stints as assistant professor at NC State, though even that has been 20 years ago now.  Either way, fingers crossed.  I've known for a long time that Tara has cancer, but somehow it is different to say we've made an appointment with the oncologist for her.  Ugh.  I will just keep loving on her lots and go from there, I guess.

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The Rainbow Bridge



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17 September 2023 - 4:22 pm
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You know it's  it so much an out when a vet graduated as long as they are keeping current on the neatest breakthroughs and learning new things. Dr. Downing is a great example (see our pain management articles for interviews with her. So hopefully you've found one who is, keep us posted!

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28 September 2023 - 11:35 am
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So Tara saw the oncologist yesterday and as a whole, it went well.  Honestly, I had prepared myself for the vet to say "yes, you need to amputate her leg" and then get to price comparison between them and my family vet and just go from there.  However, this was a little different.  They put us in a room and we saw a vet tech, who took Tara to weigh her.  But apparently while she was in the back, the oncologist also examined her, including looking for the tumor (spoiler alert - she doesn't really have one right now).  So then the vet tech brought Tara back, and then after that the oncologist showed up.  He never touched Tara while he was with us, she just stayed in the carrier.  So that was weird.  He talked about not really being able to find the tumor and I showed him the pictures I had (and then emailed to him) from August so he had those. 

Basically he did talk about possibly amputating her toe and taking part of her paw pad, but to me that wasn't really viable because it could be just as expensive or even more expensive than amputating her leg and has a lower chance of success (i.e., the cancer would be more likely to come back if they just took a small part of her foot vs. her whole leg).  (My family vet nixed that entirely and said they would not do surgery on her paw because they knew they wouldn't be able to get all of it.)  After that, the next thing he offered was metronomic chemotherapy , which she would take orally.  He started saying cancer words that got my husband all excited and I asked was it well-tolerated and he said yes.  With the caveat that most of the studies so far are just in people and dogs, not so much in cats.  So while he never said this, it's basically an experimental treatment.  He wanted to do blood work so we would have a baseline, and then a pharmacy would compound the medication and send it to us in the mail.  We would take Tara in for blood work every month (which we could do at our family vet), and then he might want to see her back every three months or so.  And the cost of the medicine is less than a hundred bucks a month.

So my husband was ecstatic and basically I agreed to this course of action and we were good to go.  We only had to pay the exam/consultation fee (which wasn't cheap, but he's an oncologist so I expected that), and then the blood work, which was comparable to what we pay at the family vet.  

I did ask him if he thinks Tara is in pain, and he said no.  I also asked about the cone and if I could take it off her, and he said that as long as she keeps chewing on her paw I should keep it on.  And she still does eventually - I take it off to feed her or if she's sitting near me and she'll bathe herself but eventually she'll go after the paw and I put the cone back on her.  So that's not great.  I am also a little worried about how the chemo will make her feel.  All in all, it was very weird for me emotionally.  I had prepared myself for amputation, and then when he gave us an alternate solution I was just kind of... numb?  I mean, I'm still worried, we might still have to amputate and whenever it happens she'll be older than she already is now.  And I worry about the cancer spreading if the chemo doesn't work.

I did at one point remind husband that this was sort of the bargain basement of second opinions, we were referred to two other places (including NC State) but the wait for an appointment was so long vs. this place which was just a couple of weeks.  But again, he was just thrilled that we had an alternative and plus the fancy cancer words and yeah.

I feel weird for having mixed feelings.

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The Rainbow Bridge



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28 September 2023 - 11:55 am
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Hmmm. Very interesting. 

First I want to say that if the appointment has allowed you and your husband to have some kind of truce on this situation, that's a good thing.

So, we have had some Tripawds member cats on metronomic chemo as a preventive, but not for a soft tissue sarcoma, usually for osteosarcoma. And honestly I can't recall many dogs getting it for that type of cancer either. It's also fallen out of favor for use when lung mets appear (which is when it was typically given), as we were told by a Colorado State vet oncologist.

Did he give you cyclophosphamide (Cytoxan) or Chlorambucil? See this post for more info on the differences:

More About Chlorambucil, Cyclophosphamide for Metronomic Chemotherapy

So the paw chewing is still not addressed, which would concern me too. How would he know she's in pain if he didn't even touch her? Or make eye contact? Or see her expressions? Ack!

I would feel weird too. That's your gut. Trust it.

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New England
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28 September 2023 - 12:03 pm
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I definitely understand why you are coming out of this appointment with mixed feelings.  On the one hand, it sounds like an option to help Tara that doesn't involve major surgery and is reasonably cost effective.  On the other, how well did the oncologist really examine Tara?  And it sounds like your husband is all on this course of treatment, whereas you are in, but maybe not wholeheartedly.  

I'm just a stranger on the internet.  I don't know what course of action I would take in your shoes.  I think the question that would really nag at me is this.  If Tara isn't in pain, why does she keep chewing on her paw?  

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28 September 2023 - 12:58 pm
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Yeah, I was told by my family vet that chemo doesn't really work for cats with this kind of cancer.  And yet this vet presented it as an option after I kind of declined the partial foot surgery.  I don't know what drug it is yet; I think he was waiting for the blood work results to come back first before deciding what to put her on.  I read a few of the posts about metronomic chemo in dogs and saw that a lot seemed to get an NSAID like metacam.  My heart cat Elly was actually on metacam for arthritis pain for maybe about 6 months near the end?  I know it can be bad in cats and cause kidney problems, but Elly always had great kidney function (we tested periodically) and the vet said there were really so few options for NSAIDs in cats.  She seemed to do better on it, though I think near the end she was in pain due to other things that it didn't really help.  But it seemed effective for arthritis for a while.  But once I know what drug it is, I'll post again and also do some research.

Apparently he examined her in the back when the tech took her to weigh her, she was gone a long time.  But I think they were mostly looking for a tumor (the tech mentioned looking at all of her toe beans and how patient she was) and she really doesn't have one right now.  They grow out of the left side of the large paw pad on her front left paw.  The skin on the pad is black, but when it grows it is pink.  They took her back in the back again later to get the blood sample and when they came back he showed me a picture he took of a tiny spot on her left front paw pad that may have been a scab (hard to tell and I haven't gone looking for it myself) so I guess he was there while the vet tech was looking or he helped look or something?  Husband wasn't really a fan of this guy up front (he was kind of loud and brash) but again, once he started spouting cancer words husband was very excited.  He did at least go put on a mask when husband asked (I am on a biologic to suppress my immune system and just had my regular infusion on Monday so I am at the lowest level of immunity right now, so I always wear a mask).  But yeah, the vet never touched Tara in front of us.  She was always in the carrier.

I will keep an eye on the paw chewing.  I have been working from home this whole week to deal with this, but next week I'm back in the office MWF and only work from home Tue & Thur.  Husband's job became 100% remote permanently in 2020 so he is always here (as is my father-in-law, but usually he is the culprit in taking the cone off to feed Tara and then forgetting to put it back on her).  She still sleeps on my pillow and bangs me in the head with the cone so I will keep looking at her paw and see how it goes.  Thanks everyone for the support, it really helps.

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5 October 2023 - 6:54 pm
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Hi all - after not hearing anything from the vet, I had husband call them yesterday and they were like "oh, yeah, blood work results..."  So after 5 pm yesterday they emailed me a document.  First of all, her blood work is fine, she doesn't have kidney disease.  So that's a relief.  The paperwork then went on to say that the type of oral chemo is "Metronomic chromotherapy would be daily oral cytoxan" (I assume chromotherapy is a typo for chemotherapy?) - so I guess I need to read up on cytoxan.  It said that this was "generally well tolerated by cats".  We would have to get monthly CBCs at our family vet if she was on the oral chemo.  

So that's that.  If we decide we want to do the oral chemo, we just call them up and then they will send the order to the compounding pharmacy who will apparently mail the drugs to us, all for less than a hundred bucks a month?  

Sorry for the short post, I have a million things going on right now but wanted to say what kind of chemo drug it was now that I actually know in writing what they are recommending.

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