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Help with decision about older dog
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Virginia



Member Since:
22 February 2013
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16
13 March 2013 - 11:38 am
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Such an agonizing situation to be in.  Again, you are to be applauded  for such honesty in the assessment of all aspects of YOUR specific situation.  Jerry, and others, will also add to go with your gut and I believe your intune with that concept also.

Clearly you are managing her pain and by following up with the sites Jerry suggested ou can perhaps give her more time with which to spoil her.  Anytime she gets to spend with just you is probably the biggest gift you can give her right now.  You are her everything and being spoiled and loved just by you  is all she needs right now

You are doing such a great job.  Just remember, Beamer isn't worrying about tomorrow, she's just in the present soaking up any special time she has with you.  Treasure those moments.

Sorrounding you with peace and total support  for your path,     

Sally and Happy Hannah

Happy Hannah had a glorious additional bonus time of over one yr & two months after amp for osteo! She made me laugh everyday! Joined April's Angels after send off meal of steak, ice cream, M&Ms & deer poop!

canada
Member Since:
16 June 2010
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13 March 2013 - 12:04 pm
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Hi Jonheese,

I have been through the same struggle, to amputate or not. I have good pet insurance so it has not been a $$$ question.

But it is still a hard decision even if it is not a financial issue.

 

We still have to weigh so many thoughts and feelings and only hope we make the best choice. My dog Abby was a rescue who had been abused and I also was concerned about her mental condition at the time. She was making excellent progress, but was still a dog in progress towards being mentally/emotionally balanced.

 

Are we making our choice for us, or our dog? Are we afraid to see our dog on 3 legs when it is not that big of an issue for the dog. Body self image may be more of a human issue than a canine issue. Are we prolonging our dog's lives because we cannot emotionally face losing them, when the dog's experience of life quality is no longer there for them. We have to make choices out of love, not projection of our own human feelings onto the dog's experience of their life.

 

We share our lives with our dogs and they are our companions. But their journeys are only connected to our path in life for their life span which is shorter than ours. So we have our hearts broken when they leave us. All you can do is make the best choice you can out of love for your dog. You will never know if you made the right choice or not because we will not walk down and experience the path not taken. Wouldn't it be nice if we could talk to our dogs and ask them what they want to do? My experience with this decision, which I have had to face with 2 German Shepherds now, is that you will never know for 100% sure what the right choice is, you will only know that it was made out of love for your dog. I think that is what would matter most to our dogs if they could talk to us.

abbydog

 

Member Since:
11 March 2013
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15 March 2013 - 6:12 am
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I'm in a bit of a hurry this morning (I'll get to that in a moment), so I have to keep this short.  Just to clarify a few things:

 

1. Yes, I realize that by not doing anything, we are implicitly making a choice, and that weighed on me.  I guess I didn't phrase that correctly in my last post.

 

2. Yes, I realize that she will not "just die".  Again, bad phrasing.  What I meant was that I had made peace with her death, so I would be ready to accept it when the decision to end her life came.

 

3. After seeing Beamer's pain increase significantly, and talking more with the doctor about what to expect after surgery and how they can help us with her recovery, we have changed our minds on our treatment plan.  We are scheduled for amputation surgery this morning and we will be pursuing chemo afterwards.  I will post more later about why we changed our minds.

 

Thank you everyone for your kind thoughts, wishes, and advice.  I will certainly be posting more here as Beamer's treatment progresses.

Member Since:
24 October 2012
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15 March 2013 - 7:28 am
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I'm glad you've changed your mind. Making sure an animal is not in pain and commiting to whatever is in her best interests should be as much of a priority as any other commitment we make in life. It's not always an easy journey but, in my opinion, that's the commitment one makes when taking in a pet.

 

 

Fort Wayne, IN
Member Since:
25 January 2013
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15 March 2013 - 7:30 am
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Just having a plan puts the mind at ease a bit, don't you think?  It did for us.  It sounds like you've done your homework and searched your heart and soul and have come to a decision that's best for Beamer and your family.  Congratulations on that.  We struggled a bit with Libby's amputation (almost 10 year old chocolate lab, OSA, right front amp on 1-31-13).  She's  a rock star in our eyes.  She's done beautifully throughout her recovery and I wish the same for Beamer.  I look forward to reading his updates.

We are all here to support and help you.  Good luck Beamer and family!

Liberty (Libby) was diagnosed with OSA on 1-22-13.  Right front amputation on 1-31-13. No IV Chemo. Metronomic Therapy started 2-19-13 along with supplements and some home cooking. Lungs clear until 1-06-14.  She's still her happy, hoppy, bossy self.  Living the dog life to the fullest and a proud Winter Warrior. :) RIP my Libby 4-21-03 to 3-19-14

Twin Cities, Minnesota
Member Since:
6 March 2013
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15 March 2013 - 8:48 am
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Good luck to you guys <3

I think just having an action plan, and taking steps on it, whatever they may be, is a huge relief. It feels better to be doing something concrete, I think, than deliberating.

As others have said, the important thing--WHICHEVER route you take--is that you are doing it out of love. THAT'S the "right" choice.

"Let us think the unthinkable, let us do the undoable, let us prepare to grapple with the ineffable itself, and see if we may not eff it after all."
-Douglas Adams, Dirk Gently's Holistic Detective Agency

"May I recommend serenity to you? A life that is burdened with expectations is a heavy life. Its fruit is sorrow and disappointment. Learn to be one with the joy of the moment."
-Douglas Adams, The Long Dark Tea-Time of the Soul

On The Road


Member Since:
24 September 2009
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15 March 2013 - 9:15 am
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Good luck to all of you, please keep us posted OK?

Tripawds Founders Jim and Rene
tripawds.com | tripawds.org | bemoredog.net | triday.pet

krun15
23
15 March 2013 - 1:04 pm
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Good luck with the surgery today.

Karen

New Haven, CT
Member Since:
27 December 2012
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15 March 2013 - 1:13 pm
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I'm not only anxious to hear how the Sx went today (please post!), but also your thought evolution.  Sending good wishes your way.  Jackson says: GO BEAMER!!!

~ Katy

ACL tear in right hind leg 12/5/12 and scheduled ACL repair surgery 12/21/12. Pre-op xrays revealed osteosarcoma. Amputation 12/28/12.  Chemo (carboplatin) started Jan 10, 2013 and ended on April 5, for a total of 5 doses. He handled carbo like a champ!  No side effects.  We started metronomic therapy at his third chemo and have been also doing some holistic treatments.  He's a lively, playful 10 year old huskie-boarder collie and a very proud member of the Winter Warriors!  Our love. Our funny little guy!

Member Since:
11 March 2013
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15 March 2013 - 1:30 pm
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Thanks again for all of the good emotions flying our way.  It helps, and we do appreciate it.

 

My wife and I are both engineers by trade, and we're very analytical thinkers.  We have been analyzing the *you know what* out of this situation since the initial tentative diagnosis by our normal vet, and we have had an "evolving plan" the whole time.  As new information comes in, we retabulate the options and recalculate the "scores" of each.  We have killed many trees in composing pro/con lists to amputation plus chemo, amputation alone, pain meds alone, pain meds plus palliative radiation, stereotactic radiation plus chemo, etc., etc., etc.

 

After first visiting Dr. Worley at CSU (without my wife), I was solidly of the opinion that we should amputate and do chemo.  That's when I made my first post here.  But after talking with my wife, doing more research online (most of which said something like "as long as your dog has a good spirit, she'll do fine"), and watching Beamer's behavior, I was starting to doubt two things: 1. that her pain would be too much for meds to handle, and 2. that we and she would be able to handle the amputation.  That's when my plan shifted to palliative intent, mostly pain meds, with the option of palliative radiation therapy as needed down the road.  That's when I made my second post above.

 

Then I spoke with Dr. Worley again on the phone, and asked her about my 1. and 2. above.  She was very accepting of my decision (which is really too strong of a word, but I don't have a better one in my vocabulary) to go in the palliative direction, but she cautioned me again about the pain of OSA, and kind of jarred me into realizing how much her behavior had changed in the past two months.  She also reassured me that they would be able to help with Beamer's recovery period, and that we wouldn't not need to watch her 24/7 for two weeks (i.e. take extended time off work) afterwards.

 

This is what changed my mind.  I talked with my wife yesterday morning about it, and at first she was resistant (which I expected), but after I left for work, she emailed me saying that Beamer's obvious pain (she would put almost no weight on that paw by this point, and wouldn't do anything but lay by my wife's side all morning) was starting to change her mind, along with having done some more research on the palliative radiation that had made her reconsider how much it would help with the pain.

 

That's when I called Dr. Worley and made the appointment for the surgery today.  Since they are a teaching hospital, I am interfacing directly with a vet student (Anastasya) for most of this, and she told me this morning that Beamer will most likely be going into surgery around 2pm MT today (30 minutes from now).

 

So I guess that's enough to post for now.  Thanks again everyone for the helpful advice and kind thoughts.  I will definitely be posting here as her treatment progresses, and I'm thinking about signing up for a blog to document it even better.

Twin Cities, Minnesota
Member Since:
6 March 2013
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26
15 March 2013 - 1:40 pm
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Healing vibes to you and your family and Beamer! You are definitely an engineer. :-) My DH is, as well. I am a writer. So our "discussions" were far less logical than yours--but one half of them sounds just like yours :p

"Let us think the unthinkable, let us do the undoable, let us prepare to grapple with the ineffable itself, and see if we may not eff it after all."
-Douglas Adams, Dirk Gently's Holistic Detective Agency

"May I recommend serenity to you? A life that is burdened with expectations is a heavy life. Its fruit is sorrow and disappointment. Learn to be one with the joy of the moment."
-Douglas Adams, The Long Dark Tea-Time of the Soul

New York, NY
Member Since:
3 December 2012
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27
15 March 2013 - 1:50 pm
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I'm late to this conversation, as I've just been following it because I dont have much to add as I am a tripawd kitty parent, so I dont have much advice on arthritis/older doggies.  I just wanted to say good luck to your Beamer, I'm sure the surgery will go great.  As for your decisions, just go with your gut.  No one knows the "right" thing to do for your baby except you and your family.  All we can tell you is our experiences, but it is ultimately your decision, there is no right or wrong!

 

All our love,

Erica & Tripawd Kitty Jill

Jill is a 9-year-old tuxedo kitty. She was diagnosed with Osteosarcoma in June 2012 on her toe in her right hind leg. Her leg was amputated on 12/12/12 and she completed four rounds of chemo (2 of Carbo, 2 of Doxy) in April 2013. "Like" Jill's facebook page: https://www.fac.....tty?ref=hl Proud member of the WINTER WARRIORS!!!! Her blog can be read at http://jillsjou.....ipawds.com. xoxo

On The Road


Member Since:
24 September 2009
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15 March 2013 - 3:26 pm
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Analyzing is a good thing, I think you've really done everything you can to make a confident decision. Kudos to you! If you ever feel like sharing the lists you started about the pros and cons of treatments, etc., we'd love to see them if you ever have time.

Meanwhile, just know you couldn't be in better hands over at CSU. We've had great experiences there every time we've treated Tripawds Spokesdog Wyatt Ray there. We have a place in Red Feather Lakes and go there in the spring...when Beamer is all healed up, let's have a Tripawds pawty!

Keep us posted ya hear? Oh and here's something that might show you what a difference the amp will make. 

This is me, the day before amputation:

preop_ucdavis03.jpgImage Enlarger

Then, the picture below is me just a week afterward opening a get well present. Can you see the difference? 

CA_803fst07.jpgImage Enlarger

Tripawds Founders Jim and Rene
tripawds.com | tripawds.org | bemoredog.net | triday.pet

Member Since:
11 March 2013
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15 March 2013 - 3:40 pm
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Nice photo, Jerry!  You and Beamer actually have some features in common, and I swear she had that same sprinkled donut toy as a youngster.  I remember because we used to roll in like a wheel down the hall and she had great fun running after it trying to catch it before it (and she) reached the dead end wall at the end! :)   I also remember it because it was great fun (*eye roll*) collecting the donut fragment by fragment as she tore it to bits over the course of about 9 months.

 

Here's Beamer this morning, her last 4-legged photo:

734099_10100939609492028_1100739988_n.jpgImage Enlarger

 

I will type up our pros/cons list(s) when I get a chance and share them here.

On The Road


Member Since:
24 September 2009
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15 March 2013 - 3:44 pm
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Oh Beamer you are such a beautiful girl! 

Dad, hang in there. If you want to come into the Chat Room we are often hanging out just gabbing away. 

Tripawds Founders Jim and Rene
tripawds.com | tripawds.org | bemoredog.net | triday.pet

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