Caring for a Three Legged Dog or Cat
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Hello,
My english setter Ruby and I are almost 7 weeks post-op for a rear leg amputation for a grade 1 fibrosarcoma. No follow up chemo was indicated, and she has been doing great. Switched to grain free , salmon oil, power mushrooms, etc. However, last week we did have a follow up with the Oncologist, where I had her looks at some tiny bumps Ruby had on her chest (small, pimple like nodules, <.5" dia). She did needle aspirations on them (four total). One came back abnormal, possible fibrosarcoma. The other three came back normal. All bumps have same appearance/feel. Recommendation is to remove all of them. Anyone else have any experience with this (fibrosarcoma reoccurance, or removal of similar bumps on chest)? Wondering how invasive the proceedure was. We have a ultrasound and Onc/Surg consult scheduled for later this month. We were so excited after her post-amp biopsy results, but unfortunately didn't expect this so soon.
Thanks,
Kim & Ruby
Sorry to hear about Ruby's new little fibro lumps... I really hope it's nothing too serious. At least she's feeling good so far... Happy 7 weeks post-amp!!!
Angel Jake's Mom
Jake, 10yr old golden retriever (fractured his front right leg on 9/1, bone biopsy revealed osteosarcoma on 9/10, amputation on 9/17) and his family Marguerite, Jacques and Wolfie, 5yr old german shepherd and the newest addition to the family, Nala, a 7mth old Bengal mix kittie. Jake lost his battle on 11/9/2009, almost 8 weeks after his surgery. We will never forget our sweet golden angel… http://jakesjou.....ipawds.com ….. CANCER SUCKS!
Hi Kim & Ruby,
I'm sorry, we personally don't have experience with fibrosarcoma but there are many Tripawds here who do. Here is one interesting post we found about it:
Wilson's fibrosarcoma pathology report…long
I can't imagine what a shock you've had after hearing that news. Try to hang in there, and don't panic until you go in for the next appointment. Or at least try your best not to. Remember, Ruby will absorb your energy, so try to stay pawsitive and don't think the worst, at least until you know all the facts OK?
Many hugs coming at you.
Tripawds Founders Jim and Rene
tripawds.com | tripawds.org | bemoredog.net | triday.pet
We're sorry to hear about Ruby's new fibrosarcoma lumps. I don't have any experience with them, but just wanted to let you know we'll keep Ruby in our hearts, and will keep fingers and paws crossed that all goes well for her.
Hugs,
Holly and Holly's mom
Holly joined the world of tripawds on 12/29/2009. She has a big little sister, Zuzu, who idolizes Holly and tries to make all of her toys into tripawds in Holly's honor. And she's enjoying life one hop at a time!
http://anyemery.....ipawds.com
Ruby is very pretty. I am sorry to hear of your diagnosis and setback.
My dog had metatastic lumps, but he had osterosarcoma not fibrosarcoma, so take my information with a big grain of salt since it is a different disease and I know nothing about fibrosarcoma.
After I found one subcutaneous lump near his flank/hip, the oncologist (who was in a different city) had us do lots of exams to see if the cancer had spread to other locations: ultrasound of internal organs, kidneys, liver, etc. Chest x-rays. She assumed it would have spread, but there was no definite signs that it had. I suspect that might be a difference between OSA and fibrosarcoma (maybe OSA is more likely to have spread). If the cancer had spread, we would not remove the lump.
We did remove the lump.
However, there was a 2-3 weeks delay before it was removed, and they could not get clean margins because it was embedded in the muscle by then. Later I learned, from a CSU oncologist, that removal might accelerate the regrowth, unless a very well trained oncological surgeon takes the lump out. If you are thinking of getting the lumps out, I'd get that to happen soon and not a few weeks from now. I think that was the difference between having a lump in the skin and one in the muscle that would not be completely removed.
It grew back extremely quickly, probably more quickly than if it had
not been removed. I think it would have grown more slowly if we had not
removed it, or if we tried radiation. Since we only had one bad lump at
that time, palliative radiation to slow or reduce the lump probably would have
been the best action to take.
Sometimes they put chemo beads at the surgical site to prevent or delay regrowth of a lump (we did not do that, but we did not have an oncologist do the surgery). Does the onco really expect surgery to help in the long run? What does she or he think about radiation in Ruby's case?
Most important now is just to let Ruby and yourself have as much fun as you can.
Thanks everyone for your replies and well wishes. She's been feeling great, and we are getting ready to go on vacation next week to the east coast. Visiting family near the ocean and lots of scenic rivers so I'm looking forward to a little R & R.
Tazzie's mom--thanks so much for sharing your experience. I wasn't sure if I wanted to wait until the end of the month to have our follow up consult, but I was reluctant to have her shaved/poked/prodded prior to heading off on a road trip. My understanding is that OSA is more likely to have spread, but fibrosarcoma generally grows more rapidly but low grades don't have a high metastatic rate. Of course, our prognosis after her amp. was excellent because the tumor was low grade, and was in her paw so we had excellent margins by removing the leg. So I know that generalizations are just that! The onco felt that the surgery would be helpful, but we were going to discuss more after the ultrasound and new chest xrays (she had a clear chest xray prior to amp.). I know nothing is absolute, I just wish I had more definite answers about reoccurance and the pathology results "possible fibrosarcoma" before putting her though more surgery.
Look at that face! Ruby, you are a beautie!
I, too am sorry about the new lumps. I have no knowledge either - I just wanted to wish you both the best and to let you know, we'll be thinking about you over here.
Comet - 1999 to 2011
She departed us unexpectedly January 23, 2011 at the age of 12 1/2.
She was born with a deformed front leg and a tripawd all of her life.
Is radiation a possibility for those little lumps if there are no other signs of "C" elsewhere (e.g, no indications of tumors from an ultrasound of the internal organs)? Palliative radiation seems to have few side effects for the dogs and might slow down the growth or even reduce it if you are lucky. But maybe they would not recommend radiation until later (we waited far too long, but that was because we have no radiation for dogs here or within a 12 hr drive).
Pam mentioned a St Bernard who lived with 24 lumps for a year (OSA) or more before it ended up getting lung mets. The lumps did not cause any particular problem for that dog so they obviously did not grow with the speed that Tazzie's did.
If they plan to do surgery, I'd ask if they can put any of those chemo beads to prevent regrowth (or some sort of chemo into the local area).
I can see why you want to wait if you are taking Ruby on a road trip. If she has the lumps removed, she won't be able to swim while she has stitches. And she looks like a dog who likes to swim. Does she? My cousin had a crazy English setter when we grew up. Boy did she 'like' rabbits and porcupines and anything else that moved!
Not sure if radiation is a possibility. I had inquired about it previously, and was told that the cost would be $4-5000. That sounds quiite high to me, but I'll just have to wait and see. I am lucky, in that I have a specialty center <10 mi from my house. That is interesting about the chemo beads. Trying to pull together a list of questions, and that will defintely be one that I will add.
Regarding swimming, she likes to run around a bit and splash, but generally she's always been a bit of a couch potato/diva. The only thing she was crazy about was countersurfing, and that stopped after she became a tripawd. One up side of surgery! My other setter, however, is psychotic for all things fur & feather--when outside, she's contantly on yard patrol!
Ha - Tazzie's counter-surfing returned after he became a tripawd. At one point, he was simply ravenous so had extra motivation to dig in the trash and check out the higher cabinets. I'll have to dig up those old posts to show you the pizza boxes, hershey kisses and tea bags (tea bags?) he pilfered at that time.
The quote I was given for radiation at CSU was surprisingly low I thought, in the $1500 range/treatment rather than 4-5 grand. We only had one lump, but it was a biggie.
If she does have lumps in other places it might not be worth doing any thing about these ones. Hopefully they will grow slowly. Definitely try to keep track of their progress in the next couple of weeks. Did the vet or onco measure them?
Countersurfing returned??? Say it isn't so. Tea bags-wow. Although, Ruby has shredded hardback books & eaten hair ties and painters tape, so nothings out of the question. Was Tassie a front or rear leg amp?
The onco didn't measure the bumps, but they are small. It's interesting to me that 3 of them came back fine, but the one was possible fibro. Again, its the "possible" part that troubles me to think about surgery again, but she (onco) mentioned she saw spiral cells in her prelim.examination of the needle aspiration of the "possible" bump. Want to see how the ultrasound turns out. Are there other diagnostics that I should be asking about? I want to do what we can, but I want to know if things are bad so I don't put her through procedures unnecessarily.
Again, I appreciate you sharing your experience and insight.
Hi Ruby
Yes, the sports of counter-surfing and trash-diving returned big-time. Hadn't seen such behaviour in years. Tazzie went through a stage when he was absolutely famished. His appetite lessened a bit from pathologically ravenous to just a typical food-hound when I added the power mushrooms, so probably he was just needing the pizza and hershey kisses. He was a front leg amp, so that would not affect counter-surfing too much. He was very very long in terms of body length, an asset to reach into the corners behind the sink, etc. Got him into trouble a few times as a youth.
Try to keep track of the size of the lumps. I did not so that, but eventually my vet started to do that. But with Tazzie the growth was fast - they doubled each week, at least following the removal. If you aren't operating for a few weeks, it will definitely be useful to know how much they grow during this time.
We did ultrasound and chest x-rays before deciding to remove his lump. As I said, the onco vet thought he would be riddled with "C" but he was not. If you have access to the technology and money is no object, you could do some sort of scan (I don't know if CT scan or MRI is what they do). But the cost of those procedures is probably crazy. We don't have an onco vet in this city, so did not have those options anyway. I would have done one of those scans if I had access to one, because then we would have known if radiation of the one lump was worthwhile (i.e., if there were no other tumors).
Switching to another chemo regime was an option that was mentioned at the time we found the lump. The onco vet was in a different city and really hard to communicate with (even my vet found her hard to track down), so we pretty much had to wing it on our own. I'm glad we did not do more chemo at that stage, because it would have made him feel badly for much of the time. The most valuable thing is knowing how great a time we had last fall and how happy and lively Tazzie was until the very end.
You are dealing with fibro, not OSA, so the treatment options might be completely different.
I have heard that they can't get a conclusive biopsy from needle aspirates. If the information is going to affect your future decisions about treatment, you will probably need to remove them to know for sure what they are. How deep are these lumps? I have been assuming that they are just under the skin.
Ruby is a rear leg amp, so hopefully countersurfing will not return. She is long bodied, long necked, and long snouted (word?). Her best was opening the toaster oven and helping herself to what was cooking in it! She was crafty like that.
I'm trying to keep track of the lumps. They seemed bigger after the needle aspiration, but I don't know if that is because they got irrittated or because she was shaved and I could clearly feel them. I'm not sure how deep they are, they are under the skin but I'm not sure how you can determine depth. Hoping to have some questions answered at our next appointment, and determine what our next steps will be. As far as other diagnostics, I thought I had read that some people had body scans done. I'll ask about it, but cost unfortunately would weigh in on that decision. Great info, I'll let you know how things go and share some beach pics when we return from vacation!
Thanks,
Kim & Ruby
Back from vacation, and Ruby had a great time. It was a big love fest between her & my 4 yo niece, which was really nice because Ruby hasn't been around little ones. Took some cute pics of them. Once I figure out how to post them, I'll share a couple. We had our ultrasound & onco/surgery consult yesterday, and her kidneys look great. However, the big decision we need to make is whether or not to remove the lumps. She has five lumps now (discovered another one)--1 near her amp. incision site, and the other four on her front side/chest/leg areas. The lumps have not really changed in size, and I noticed them >2 months ago. The surgeon and oncologist recommended we go at least 2 cm around each lump, and possibly a greater depth. I am reluctant to put her through this. The surgeon made it sound like no big deal, but it would be essentially (5) 4cm chunks taken out. I told them I needed to think about it, and would let them know my decision later on this week. Although not the ultimate deciding factor, the surgery estimate (with post op biopsies) is also another $1,800-2,000. With five lumps now, I'm relectant to put her through this and end up "chasing lumps" if they continue to occur. She's happy, active, and comfortable (except for her razor burn from her ultrasound shave!) and I don't want to make her unnecessarily uncomfortable. I am strongly leaning towards no surgery, but worry I am making the wrong decision.
On an somewhat unrelated note, I DVR'd Nature/Why We Love Cats & Dogs last night. Can't wait to watch it!
Thanks for the ear,
Kim & Ruby
rubydawg said:
Took some cute pics of them. Once I figure out how to post them, I'll share a couple.
I am strongly leaning towards no surgery, but worry I am making the wrong decision.
I DVR'd Nature/Why We Love Cats & Dogs last night. Can't wait to watch it!
Sounds like Ruby had a great time. Can't wait to see photos, the easiest way to share photos is to start a Tripawds Blog for Ruby and upload them their. Otherwise, if you upload your photos somewhere else (i.e.; flickr, etc.) here are instructions for embedding images in forum posts.
Remember, there are no wrong decisions here, and no regrets. Any decision you make is one that Ruby cannot make for herself. Our best advice is to choose your treatment plan, enjoy every day, and don't look back.
Enjoy the show! 
Tripawds Founders Jim and Rene
tripawds.com | tripawds.org | bemoredog.net | triday.pet
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