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Our 7 year old lab/shepard mix, Callie, is scheduled to have her right hind leg amputated this coming Thursday for osteosarcoma that was diagnosed last Sunday. Xrays did not show any metastasis' in her lungs yet. However, according to my research since meeting with the vet, I have learned there is a 90% chance it is there and just not showing up yet. Our vet did not give us a real life expectancy estimate…"could be 6 months, could be 6 years". We were very hopeful after meeting with the vet and scheduling the surgery, but after doing research online, I am realizing she most likely will only live a few months after surgery.
We are planning to do surgery only, no chemo. I hate seeing her in pain, but I am struggling with the decision to amputate if she may only live a couple of months afterwards. Unfortunately, it comes down to spending so much $$ for a possibility of only having her for another 4 or 5 months. I realize there is no way to know and the quality of life is more important, but statistics are not on her side…
Please share your stories (good or bad) of during surgery only with no chemo to help us make our decision. If it did spread to your dog's lungs, how quickly did it appear and how long did they live afterwards? Do they suffer alot once its in the lungs?
7:17 am
28 November 2008
Offline
I can't share the story you are looking for because we chose to do chemo, but I will share this from our vet. His recommendation with no mets present is surgery. Surgery is the only way to stop the pain, and osteosarcoma is extremely painful. He consulted with us on a Tuesday evening, made the recommendation for surgery, gave us all the options, and told us we didn't have to decide that minute, but he would clear his calendar the next morning to be available for surgery.
I took her in at 7AM on my way to work, still not sure we were doing the right thing. It wasn't until we picked her up on Friday, and I saw she was happy and mobile, that I knew we had made the right choice. She lived 27 1/2 months cancer free. We had to let her go due to complications of arthritis.
Shanna & Spirit Trouble ~ Trouble gained her wings 3/16/2011, a 27 1/2 month cancer survivor, tail wagging. RIP sweetheart, you are my heart and soul. Run free at Rainbow Bridge.
The November Five - Spirits Max, Cherry, Tika, Trouble & Nova. 11/2008 - 3/2013 An era ends as Queen Nova crossed the Bridge.
Hi Callie and family
Welcome and sorry you too are having to face these decisions. There is an enormous amount of information to sift through. You can find heaps of info and opinions on this website if you know where to search in the archives. You are not the only person who had to consider the costs when making these decisions.
Statistically, I have heard that surgery plus chemo gives an average of 7 mos until mets are diagnosed, something like 12 mos survival. Without chemo, the average is supposed to be something closer to 4 months although I might have that number wrong. (However, when they say 'with chemo', I think they mean dogs that successfully completed chemo, and some of our dogs don't get that far - they might get mets during chemo and then stop the chemo.)
Amputation is primarily to relieve the pain, not just to get rid of the primary tumour. Without the amp, the dog will likely have a fracture within a couple of months and that will force a decision to amputate or euthanize at that time. One other option to amputation is bisphosphonates (see the video link that Jerry posted), which is a drug that helps strengthen the bone and so helps prevent a fracture. Dogs that are not candidates for amputation, such as dogs with tumours in two legs, have used that treatment and it seems to have worked well. Bisphosphonates can be used in combo with radiation, but again we are talking money for any of these treatments. The bisphosphonate that Jerry made a video of costs lots of money - not sure about other drugs.
As for lung mets, my dog ended up having another kind of met (subcutaneous, lumpy mets). But I have read about lots of lung met dogs on this website. The amazing thing about our dogs is that they take life one day or one step at a time. They live with great quality until the time when they are no longer ready to live. We fear their condition eroding and the idea they might end up in pain. But it is amazing how well they do, pretty much until the moment they are no longer ready to continue. Of course, for dogs we have the option to intervene on their behalf. Lung met dogs seem to have ups and downs (you can find some gross and often entertaining stories on this website about dogs with a clot that end up needed to cough it up before they get back to rabbit-chasing form).
Back to how long a dog might have: despite the averages, you will see enormous variation in survival for dogs on this website, both for dogs that had chemo and those that did not. I believe Eisen is featured prominently now, facing his 3rd year ampuversary and he had no chemo! Clearly that is exceptional, but he is certainly not the only case of a non-chemo dog who is doing really really well. On the other side, many of us had mets within a month or two of surgery even though we had started chemo. No-one can tell you where you will fall on this scale.
Is it worth it? Well, you don't know if your dog will have 1 month or 4 months or 4 years (probably something closer to 4 to 12 months is more realistic). Was it worthwhile for me to have Tazzie for four months after amputation even though he ended up getting mets? Definitely. He was a healthy lively full of life dog - how could I have euthanized him just because his leg was in pain? And how would I know whether he would live 2 months or two years?
When it comes to these decisions, some people try to picture what they will regret more. Treating the dog and having her pass early? Or not treating and never knowing how long or well she might have lived?
It might only have been four months, but we tripawds definitely figure out how to live for the moment - those months will probably be the best ones of your life in many ways.
Hope this helps!
Susan of Tazzie 2
9:25 am
Hi,
My Shepard-Boxer-Ridgeback X, Isabelle was probably a little over 12, with severe L-S spine arthritis, when she was diagnosed w/OSA in her L rear leg last August. Her leg was amputated almost immediately. I chose to treat her holistically...not a big change from the path she'd been on for some time, just a few more homeopathics, supplements and herbs to those that already supported her raw diet. She gets acupuncture, massage therapy and various other physical therapy modalities which keep her active. She is also on an NSAID, which may be beneficial as an angiogenesis inhibitor. I used arteminisin for about 3 months, but stopped because it gave her reflux & it wasn't worth any discomfort to her.
She had a second cancer, a mast cell tumor in her other leg in January. The mass was resected & it's removal considered complete.
At almost eleven months and over 13 years old she is free of visible mets. I made my choices fully expecting her to only survive four to six months. I wanted those months to be extraordinary for her...She really never had a bad day from the moment she came home 24 hours post op. I was not willing to exchange a moment of her happiness for the stress of multiple, day long visits to the oncologist. I don't know what tomorrow will bring, but every day past my self imposed deadline has been a gift and a joy.
Veterinary medicine from both a technical and humane perspective simply cannot support the curative chemotherapeutic options necessary to successfully treat most malignancies in animals. There is really no definitive indicator as to which tumor is more aggressive and which is not, including pathologic exams. You will find dogs on both ends of the treatment spectrum who outlive statistics, as well as those, who sadly do not.
You are the only one who can make the best decision for your dog and individual circumstances. Just know that you have options.
Here's a short clip of Isabelle 11 months post OSA diagnosis and amputation.
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