Caring for a Three Legged Dog or Cat
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Hi to all,
Abby is a combination British Columbia Canadian and Texas Hill Country Dog. You might say she has dual citizenship.
I am trying to discover how to post pictures other than the profile picture. When I get the time I will play with the blog capabilities.
I think the blogs are really useful for people who want to understand and share where they are at. So they are very informative.
We are looking at vet homeopathy care, not as an alternative to standard vet practice, but to compliment it. I wonder if anyone has experience with homeopathic approaches to canine cancer care.
Abby dog.
abbydog said:
We are looking at vet homeopathy care, not as an alternative to standard vet practice, but to compliment it. I wonder if anyone has experience with homeopathic approaches to canine cancer care.
Many, many, many dogs here use homeopathy care ... alone or as a complement to Western care. Take a look around the forums or the blogs. You'll find a lot of it.
Good luck!
Amputation on 11/10/09, due to Histiocytic Sarcoma in left elbow. Angel Harley earned his wings on 06/24/10.
I am trying to discover how to post pictures other than the profile picture.
The fastest, easiest way...is if you have a Facebook account. Once you upload them there, then you can just copy the Photo URL and paste them here. Otherwise, you have to have a place to store the photos online. A supporter tripawd blog will give you a place also.
We can show you how to paste your photos if you aren't familiar with it.
Hmmmm...dual citizenship. Not sure if we can tease a half, "Good ol' southern gal".
Comet - 1999 to 2011
She departed us unexpectedly January 23, 2011 at the age of 12 1/2.
She was born with a deformed front leg and a tripawd all of her life.
abbydog said:
I am trying to discover how to post pictures other than the profile picture...
We are looking at vet homeopathy care...
Here are instructions for adding images to forum posts. If you don't already share your photos online (i.e.; flickr, photobucket, etc.) starting a blog for Abby and uploading them there may be the easiest way.
Be sure to review our homepathic dog care posts in the Tripawds Nutrition blog . Specifically, this post introducing holistic dog cancer vet Dr. Charles Loops may be of interest.
Tripawds Founders Jim and Rene
tripawds.com | tripawds.org | bemoredog.net | triday.pet
abbydog said:
We are looking at vet homeopathy care, not as an alternative to standard vet practice, but to compliment it. I wonder if anyone has experience with homeopathic approaches to canine cancer care.
Hello,
I am treating Maggie completely with homeopathy with Dr. Charles Loops in NC. He can treat your dog doing standard care along with homeopathics. What are your concerns?
Tracy, Maggie's Mom
Maggie was amputated for soft tissue sarcoma 10-20-09
Maggie lost her battle with kidney disease on 8-24-13
Hi Abby's pawrents,
I'm so sorry that you're having to go through this difficult decision. In my case, my sweet 10yr old golden retriever Jake broke his leg, a pathological fracture due to his bone cancer. Our only options were to amputate to save his life, or to put him to sleep. I'm not sure what I would have done if his leg hadn't broken… Maybe I also would have waited… I really don't know.
I know what a difficult decision this is for you and your wife to make. So I guess you just have to take all the research, read about everyone else's stories… and then make a decision and stick to it.
My Jake only lived almost 8 weeks after his surgery (10 weeks after he broke his leg and was diagnosed with bone cancer). It definitely wasn't long enough… but Jake was happy and enjoyed his life until the very end. We were so grateful for the extra time we did get to spend with him…
So many other dogs here live so much longer after their amputation… totally beating the odds that were given to them! A few have died on the operating table or shortly after their surgery… No matter what you do, there are no guarantees… You must do what feels right in your heart… and then try not to second guess your decision. (easier said than done!)
I previously lost two of my german shepherds before I had Jake… One of them had acute renal failure at 4 yrs of age and he died within 3 days… the other one had a hemangiosarcoma in his heart which bled out and he lost his life within 24 hours. He was only 5yrs old. It was all so quick and sudden…
I currently have a 5yr old german shepherd (Wolfie)… so I have a soft spot in my heart for german shepherds… and goldens!
I guess my post hasn't really helped you with your decision… But whatever you and your wife do decide for Abby, we will all be here for you and support you 100%!!!
Angel Jake's Mom
P.S. I'm also a fellow Canadian (born and raised in Montreal) and have been living in the states for almost 20 years now…
Jake, 10yr old golden retriever (fractured his front right leg on 9/1, bone biopsy revealed osteosarcoma on 9/10, amputation on 9/17) and his family Marguerite, Jacques and Wolfie, 5yr old german shepherd and the newest addition to the family, Nala, a 7mth old Bengal mix kittie. Jake lost his battle on 11/9/2009, almost 8 weeks after his surgery. We will never forget our sweet golden angel… http://jakesjou.....ipawds.com ….. CANCER SUCKS!
Hi to Tracy, Maggie's mom,
Our Vet surgeon said he thought there was a place for homeopathy, particularly in pain management and side effects of Chemo. He said it would not be effective in either curing cancer or altering the progression of the disease. He said to be careful of any claims that it would cure or alter the prognosis. I am not sure what questions I would have, other than looking for anything to help Abby that has validity. Maybe just knowing what experiences other people have had with it would be helpful. Thanks for responding.
Abby dog
My dog was amputated Oct 20th, 2009. In December, I put her on homeopathics with Dr. Loops. I had originally started her shortly after surgery but then took her off it because she was very ill after surgery and wanted to get her 'healthy' again before starting her on any treatments. She is on a rotating remedy protocol...three remedies that pertain to Maggie's case. These would be different from dog to dog, so it doesn't really matter what they are to you in your dog's case. I also have her on Transfer Factors Complete, per Dr. Loops. He didn't feel I needed to give her any other supplements besides these (besides the usual Omegas and healthy, low carb diet of course). His words to me when I had a consult with him was that the homeopathics were "to help keep the cancer from spreading".
Dr. Loops is a well known cancer treatment homeopath in the world of holistics. I highly suggest him if that is one of the routes you want to go with treatments!
I know of two other dog's personally that have been treated by him for cancer. My sister's Pitbull for mast Cell Grade II. She was diagnosed at age 5 or 6. She is pushing SIXTEEN and still here! Then a friend of hers mix breed was diagnosed with OSA back when she was 2 yrs. old I think(Addie - Rene has a story on her from my sister but it hasn't been published yet?). Addie is still here as well at the age of TWELVE! Both dogs treated by Dr. Loops for two different cancers.
Those are two that I personally know besides my own dog, of course.
Hope this helps...
Tracy, Maggie's Mom
Maggie was amputated for soft tissue sarcoma 10-20-09
Maggie lost her battle with kidney disease on 8-24-13
Abby Dog, I would definitely agree with your vet that caution should be used when seeking alternative medicine help. There is a lot of snake oil out there and bad advice. But my advice is to seek help from qualified vets who have studied homeopathy and natural medicine. Dr. Loops is definitely one of them.
You can add to the list of dogs we personally know who have been treated by him and outlived any prognosis:
Three Paws, Two Years, No Problem!
2 Years and More: Eisen Fights Bone Cancer with Homeopathy
Another well-respected natural medicine vet you may want to consider consulting with:
Your Tripawd Can Live a Hoppier Life with Dr. Marty’s Advice
Tripawds Founders Jim and Rene
tripawds.com | tripawds.org | bemoredog.net | triday.pet
Obviously there are any number of treatment options out there, and you're choices are bordering on overwhelming. I don't know if this will help, but after reading this whole thread it seems like we need to break it back down to basics:
FACT: Although not as invasive or fast-spreading as osteosarcoma, your vets have said that this type of cancer will eventually kill her even if the tumor is removed (but the leg is left attached). The tumor has been removed, but some of it remains and will eventually grow back. Thus, bone sparing and tumor removal are stop-gap options at best, not permanent solutions.
FACT: Although this cancer doesn't metastasize as often as others (about 10% to 20%) of the time, there is still the danger of it doing so if the leg remains attached.
FACT: You've been told that homeopathy might be useful to help with pain management and chemo side effects, but it will not cure or slow down the cancer.
FACT: No vet has told you that Abby won't be in pain if the leg remains attached. All they can do is try to manage the pain to some extent, but it will always be there to some degree.
CONCLUSION: If Abby were my dog the choice would be clear. Amputate. From everything I've read here, your only other option is to leave the leg on and keep your fingers crossed that maybe it won't metastasize into the lungs. And even if it doesn't, the disease will eventually kill her anyway if the leg is left attached. To use a blunt metaphor, that seems like playing Russian Roulette over and over again until the gun eventually goes off. You may buy some time for a little while, but eventually things will end badly. And the doctors have said that the entire time, there will be leg pain to manage as the tumor slowly grows and eats it away. Going back to the dull toothache analogy, she might be able to function, but where's the enjoyment in life if you have to view it through a constant haze of pain? Removing the leg is the one guaranteed method of separating the disease from the host, and making the pain go away permanently. All other options are maybes at best, and involve a lot more long-term pain or discomfort for Abby.
And I understand your wife's reluctance to risk a drastic surgery like amputation after the loss of your other dog. But if this is the best option with a real chance of permanently solving the problem, then it needs to be done. Any surgery carries the inherent risk of something going catastrophically wrong, but the fact is, most of the time nothing does. Your other dog was 11 years old, which is a senior citizen for a German Shepherd. Abby is a comfortable middle-aged 7, and is correspondingly stronger and less susceptible to shocks to her system. I won't lie to you – this is a drastic solution, and the first two weeks post-amputation are going to be very unpleasant. But Abby will get better, and you'll be shocked at how quick and complete that recovery will be. I said it earlier and I'll say it again – the Tripawds motto of "It's better to hop on three legs than limp on four" is absolutely true. Give Abby a chance to live pain-free.
We'll be here no matter what you do or what questions you have. Good luck.
Hi Maxidad,
I don't disagree with anything you have said. Abby's tumor was grade 1-low. It was causing her no pain that I could see. She is running, jumping and her normal healthy happy and rambunctious self. It was very small, the size of a marble or walnut. I have no doubt it will return, in one month or eight months. As soon as we see any sign of its return or pain the gameplan is amputation surgery immediately. I am concerned that she may have pain she is not showing, but it sure does not seem that way now. And she does show pain.
Is it a risk to wait? Yes, but the risk of firbrosarcoma mets is low given size and stage of tumor. There is no guarantee that it has not spread already. We have consulted two specialists. They both said nothing is certain with cancer, but it will return. Their professional opinion is that the best chance of a cure is leg amputation and her chances are better the sooner the tumor is removed. They can only professionally advise the best option for the dogs health with the least risk. Surgery itself is a risk. They do confirm that to wait for a while is very low risk, but not to wait too long.
Why are we waiting and how long will we wait. It is an emotional choice, but I am also finding it is just as hard to wait. We are in a watchful waiting period with the full expectation that surgery may be as soon as two weeks or probably not more than a month. Maybe we are lucky that we have sometime to adjust to the choice.
I do appreciate your advise, and it is the same discussion I have had with my wife and myself.
Abby dog
Good discussion. Hopefully it will help you with the difficult decisions you face. It is certain to help others facing the same. Thanks Maxidad!
Tripawds Founders Jim and Rene
tripawds.com | tripawds.org | bemoredog.net | triday.pet
Hi and Thank you to all who have been so helpfull,
I see a continuing reference to how difficult the first two weeks are after amputation. I would like to be prepared for that and what would be needed to have and to expect. I am sure there is a section of this site that is specifically about the first two weeks post-op. I just cannot find it. Maybe it is blogs or another forum topic. I have found some information such as preparing floors not to be slippery, raising the food and water dish. We have a multi-level home which has lots of stairs, inside and outside. How soon can I expect Abby to handle stairs with our help? I have lots of time so I don't care if it takes her a while to go up and down.
Our surgeon said many dogs do very well immediately after surgery. He said the last one he did, the dog walked on his own that same evening to do his business outside. Where we will have the surgery done, Abby will be in post-op care for 3 days to monitor her pain and meds and to work with the physio tech. They have vet and staff 24 hours a day. I know every dog will be different, but a general idea of what to expect in the days following amputation.
They discourage owners from visiting because it stresses the dog when they leave without them, and it is difficult to get the dog to relax again. We can visit if we demand it, but they strongly advise against it. They reassure us she will be in good hands and with good care. They have phone contact updates on her with the post op care technician.
This site is positive about amputation, which is good and we need that support. But we have also seen other web sites that were not so positive with some dogs becoming fixated on the lost leg and continually licking the surgery site, no appetitie and very listless. It is like they were affected mentally. Our Surgeon tells us that generally dogs do very well mentally and physically with amputation. Again, no guarantees in life. I looked at my Birth Certificate again just to make sure that I could not find a warranty or guarantee there somewhere in fine print. No such luck.
Abby dog
First two weeks were living HELL for my dog. You won't get a pretty picture out of my experiences! Five days after surgery, my dog stopped eating but did keep drinking...ALOT. She had a low grade fever for two weeks, nothing traditional for meds would bring it down...did homeopathic Belladonna and it broke. But this wasn't until exhausting all conventional ideas to get her to eat...three vet visits back and forth to two different vets - regular one and surgery one...stomach nausea meds, switch antibiotics, take off pain meds, give her fluids to flush out her system thinking anesthesia after effects. I had to hand feed her foods....that varied from day to day what she would eat. Never her normal food. Fried eggs, scrambled eggs, chicken, dry kibble, canned food....would like it some days other days turn her nose up. Had to put one piece at a time in her mouth, sometimes forcing her to take it...and then she would eat for me.
It was horrible, horrible, horrible. I'm not going to sugar coat it! BUT she finally pulled thru, her fever went down and presto! started eating again!! Don't really like to bring up those times but also want those of you that are facing amputation not get a tainted wrong picture either.
That said, there are OODLES of dogs on this list that have bounced back with absolutely NO issues whatsoever!
Luck be with you Abby dog!
Tracy, Maggie's Mom
Maggie was amputated for soft tissue sarcoma 10-20-09
Maggie lost her battle with kidney disease on 8-24-13
abbydog said:
This site is positive about amputation, which is good and we need that support. But we have also seen other web sites that were not so positive with some dogs becoming fixated on the lost leg and continually licking the surgery site, no appetitie and very listless. It is like they were affected mentally. Our Surgeon tells us that generally dogs do very well mentally and physically with amputation. Again, no guarantees in life. I looked at my Birth Certificate again just to make sure that I could not find a warranty or guarantee there somewhere in fine print. No such luck.
Hi Abby dog,
Jerry's Required Reading list is a good place to start on information about amps and treatments.
What those other sites are talking about sounds to me like the first couple of weeks after amputation. All dogs are different and heal in their own way and at their own pace. My pug Maggie was walking on her own the day of surgery, she was a rear amp. She was clearly not comfortable and not happy though. And yes, during the healing process I wondered if I had done the right thing. Unfortunately Tripawds did not come into existence until after my girl had her amp. All the vet told me was most dogs bounce right back, so when Maggie was clearly unhappy for a few weeks I thought maybe I had made a mistake. But when I thought about it I realized that Mag had never been that adaptable, and for her a longer adaptation period made sense.
Many here will tell you the first two weeks are very tough, and I found that to be true. But I have no regrets about what I did. In fact Maggie turned her prognosis of 6 to 9 months survival post amp into 3 years and 9 months!! She had mast cell cancer, and we did chemo after amp, but she surprised us all. I recently lost her, but it was to a second type of cancer.
You are right that there are no guarantees- bad thing sometimes happen with this major surgery. But you have to weigh that risk against giving Abby the best shot at a pain free, happy dog life.
And to add a happy ending to Tracy's story about her Maggie above- check out her blog to see how well Maggie Moo is doing these days.
Karen and the pug girls
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