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How long for chemo treatment to show result?
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7 October 2015
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10 May 2016 - 9:16 pm
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Tipper is a front leg amputee. After 6 rounds of carboplatin - less than two months out from that, he started having mysterious pain. X-Rays show a mass at his scapula which has grown in the three weeks between x-rays.

I opted for another round of carboplatin (there is also a single lung lesion which appears to be growing). Hope is that it will shrink the tumors, based on the theory that the original carboplatin kept the disease at bay so well. There was zero evidence of cancer at the time of treatment #5. 

His recent carboplatin treatment was on Thursday, 5/5 - just under a week ago. He seems to be feeling more pain in that area than ever. 

My question is this: IF the carboplatin is going to shrink the tumor, how much time should it take to notice a result in his pain?? Would tumor and pain subside over the course of a couple weeks, or does it show an impact more quickly? 

He tends to be a little "stumbly" a few days after a treatment, but I can tell his pain has increased. I don't think that's an effect of the chemo. 

I'm just wondering if there's any likelihood that he will see improvement from the chemo over the next couple weeks if he hasn't improved yet. 

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Virginia



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10 May 2016 - 9:43 pm
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Have.no.answers.for you. Just wanted to send some love.and support while you're waiting for our Vet's response.

In the meantime, is Tipper on any pain meds? Have you talked to the.vet.about managing his pain for now until things.improve?

Paws crossed for a good outcome for sweet.Tipper. Try and stay in the moment.and continue to spoil and love and spoil and love some .ore, along with treats of course!

Hugs!heart

Sally and Alumni Happy Hannah and Merry Myrtle and Frankie too

Happy Hannah had a glorious additional bonus time of over one yr & two months after amp for osteo! She made me laugh everyday! Joined April's Angels after send off meal of steak, ice cream, M&Ms & deer poop!

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11 May 2016 - 12:13 am
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Thanks. Much appreciated! Lots of pain meds. We go to our regular vet for bloodwork on Sat, so can give us some direction on increase. His office and ACIC work well in tandem. I took the day off today, just 'cuz. Lots of snuggle time, lots of treats, and a nice ride in the car for both of my boys today! 🐾🐾🐾

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11 May 2016 - 6:49 pm
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In my experience if the cancer comes back while on carboplatin then there is usually not much point to continuing the same drug, although I would certainly defer to your oncologist.   I would consider Adriamycin or trying something oral such as Palladia plus cyclophosphamide (metronomic chemo).

Pam

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11 May 2016 - 7:00 pm
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Thanks for the feedback.

She did talk about those as options. But somehow we landed on another carboplatin first. Throughout treatments, there was zero sign of any mets. I think she figured that the carboplatin kept it at bay pretty well. 

She said that metronomics were an option at any point along the way, and I think that's where we're headed next. The concern is the pain from the scapular tumor. I think that dealing with the pain when he's otherwise pretty healthy is the hardest aspect to remain more dog about the whole thing!

I'm just wondering *IF* the recent carboplatin was going to have a shrinking/relief effect on the scapula, how long might it take for me to notice an improvement in his symptoms? Does the drug work over the course of a few weeks or is it more immediate in knocking out cancer cells? 

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Virginia



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11 May 2016 - 8:39 pm
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Just a suggestion, the Onco who is suggesting this route would be in a good.position to answer this. If I recall, it seems that.in your other posts she was moving forward with the chemo because.she had seen results by using more chemo. I may be completely wrong with my recollection. Also, let her know that Tipper's pain is your immediate concern and, if the chemo won't being immediate relief, what will?

I know you hate seeing Tipper hurt. Ugh! Hope this gives him some.relief.

Sending hugs!!

Sally and Alumni Happy Hannah and Merry Myrtle and Frankie too!

Happy Hannah had a glorious additional bonus time of over one yr & two months after amp for osteo! She made me laugh everyday! Joined April's Angels after send off meal of steak, ice cream, M&Ms & deer poop!

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11 May 2016 - 8:46 pm
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Murphy had his chemo out at MSU.  After he finished his last dose, they found what they thought was a tumor on his left scapula (he had had his right front leg removed).  What the oncologist explained to me was that they could try a different chemo because if it was a metastasis of the same cancer, the same chemo wouldn't help since it grew during that treatment.   We decided not to do any more chemo and just watch it.  With follow-up x-rays, it didn't grow - that was about 2 1/2 years ago.  He still has the lump there and we still don't know what it is.  And he has a couple of other lumps that have popped up, probably lymph nodes, but possibly lipomas, but we won't have them checked.  We've been very blessed, and Murphy is still doing very well 3 years after his surgery.

Donna

Donna, Glenn & Murphy 

Murphy had his right front leg amputated due to histiocytic sarcoma at 7 years old. He survived 4 years, 2 months & 1 week, only to be taken by hemangiosarcoma at 11 1/2 years 6/12/17  
Read about Murphy's Life on Three Legs

Donna.png

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12 May 2016 - 1:40 pm
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I would ask the oncologist because I have never gone beyond 6 carboplatin injections.  If the tumor is destroying bone cells you could also consider pamidronate or similar drugs for pain relief.  This is an injection that your vet needs to administer with IV fluids.  I'm sure your dog is already taking an NSAID as well as tramadol plus gabapentin and/or amantadine to control pain.

Pam

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12 May 2016 - 5:41 pm
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Thanks, everyone. 

The oncologist is out of town for another week. 🙁 But I'm planning on calling tomorrow anyway. We go see our regular vet, Dr. Rog. on Saturday for the CBC. At least he'll be able to give us direction on increasing pain medication. If he feels there's need, he can even take an x-ray there to see if there's been a change. 

I've just been looking for a glimmer of hope that maybe the area might still show some improvement over time, but the pain is just getting worse. He hurts more now then he did before the amputation. Since he's a front amputee, all the weight just slams on that scapula area all the time. 

I'll call the cancer center too, just to see what they have to say. I missed their follow-up phone call today. 🙁 

I don't think there's anything we can do except the pain pills for another couple of weeks. Right now, I'm not sure if it's fair to make him hold out that long if this thing is going to continue to get in the meantime. 

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Virginia



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12 May 2016 - 9:18 pm
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Perhaps when you call tomorrow, you could let them know the situation and see.if they would forward your concerns ro that Onco and ask.that she call you. Maybe go beyond asking...go straight to begging!

If that won't work, ask if you could email your questions and have rhem email to her.

Have all yoir ducks.in a row. Ask all the.questions you've asked here AND include the.suggestions from "our" vet. Yes, getting the pain managed is yiur focus for.now. Sounds like the pamidronate could bring some pain relief! You need more guarantees, if that's possible, that the chemo route, is likely to bring avout good results AND how quickly!! Is this the same chemo or a different one?

I know you're between a rock and a hard place right now. Seeing your precious Tipper hurt with every step.must be awful. You are trying to find solutions and doing everything you can to do.so.

I hope you can get some support and answers tomorrow from the Onco. Keep us posted. We're all cheering for Tipper and sending lots of.positive thoughts and healing energy!!

Love and hugs.........

Sally and Alumni Happy Hannah and Merry Myrtle and Frankie too!

PS. One more quick thought. Would a doggy stroller be helpful at this point?

Happy Hannah had a glorious additional bonus time of over one yr & two months after amp for osteo! She made me laugh everyday! Joined April's Angels after send off meal of steak, ice cream, M&Ms & deer poop!

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13 May 2016 - 12:00 pm
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Thanks for everything here. What a stressful day we've had. Right now, they're trying to get ahold of the Onco to see if she has any thoughts. Bottom line: we're on max pain pills. Can't leave him in this much pain for 6 more days until she returns. The Onco. Techs have advised. 

Mum coming to terms with the fact that nothing is going to shrink the scapula problem, so I'm not even sure it's worth moving forward at this point.

The tough thing is that last week, Dr. O was SO adamant that we had lots of options left to try. 

He's hurting just to lie down and get back up again, so even a doggy stroller won't help. 

This is where it's so hard - do I "buy" a couple months with radiation or other drugs. He's in too much pain to just do nothing. Depending on what Dr. O has to say, tomorrow might be the day. We had already set up an appointment with Dr Rogerson for CBC tomorrow for Tipper and heart worm test for Logan. 

Last night and this morning were rough with scapula pain. Cancer clinic insisted we get CBC TODAY rather than wait until our appointment tomorrow. The doctors at ACIC aren't in today, and our regular vet was booked, one of the doctors had called in sick, and our doctor had a surgery today. So, we went somewhere else for bloodwork. No problem with bloodwork. 

i dropped everything in the middle of first hour to get things arranged for a sub for the rest of the day. 

Exhausted!!

I'm pretty sure I just gave Tipper the wrong dose a little while ago. I think we will be napping for a little bit! 

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Virginia



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13 May 2016 - 12:31 pm
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I'm sure you are exhausted and stressed beyond words.

Glad the bloodwork came back.okay.

Hoping they can get in touch with the Onco! I hope they really understand how import this is. Is there any.ither Onco there (not a tech) who could help? Goodness knows you are trying EVERYTHING! This piece of crap disease makes up it's own rules and can make unexpected turns anytime it wants.

Hopefully you can get some more definite answers from the Onco and then you can determine your path. You are right, at some point, depending on the length and amount of pain, it's not "worth it" for an extra month or whatever from a dog's perspective. One thing that you mjst always know, is Tipper jas been, and continues to be, loved and spoiled every seond he has been with you! And he wouldn't trade his time with you for anything!

While Tipper is taking a "nap",try and take a nap yourself. Stay fully present with your sweet Tipper and let him.know we're cheering for him. Ice cream...have you given him some ice cream? That has healing powerswinker

Sending you love.and support......

Sally and Alumni Happy Hannah and Merry Myrtle and Frankie too!

Happy Hannah had a glorious additional bonus time of over one yr & two months after amp for osteo! She made me laugh everyday! Joined April's Angels after send off meal of steak, ice cream, M&Ms & deer poop!

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